Having read the detail on the Imperial Fists in the latest HH book it seems they specialise in void warfare and boarding assaults as well as ground based siegecraft. They're also noted to use large numbers of Caestus Assault Rams and Terminators.

Maybe an epic Imperial Fists army should have a mandatory spacecraft included? 1+ Terminators could be fitting too.

Good intel Glyn, thanks for sharing

However, this list is intended to represent the Imperial Fists in full on siege-defence mode as voted for by the community, adding in spacecraft gives them significant flexibility in hitting the enemy deployment zone with orbital strikes and mass drop pod assaults which to my mind goes against the overall theme of the list

As I said earlier I'm keen to create a separate, more aggressive list, based around the codex list with some IF themed options (after all, IF are meant to be about as codex as you can get without painting your armour blue...)

I d love to include thunderhawks, assault rams and drop podding centurions, but its too much of a stretch for the defensive nature of the list as it stands

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I assume you meant 'Not' overly fond..... me either, but apparently the IF use large numbers of them so it's a fluff inclusion and seems the most sensible list to use them in



this is due to my using the EpicUK list to write this one, EpicUK have 'plus transport' as before the game, you can decide whether to take rhinos, footslog or pod them in, in NetEA you have to choose as part of the list, it's just a wording issue



well there has to be some constraints, I am also trying to encourage the use of tactical marines



The Fellblade is mostly included so those of us fortunate enough to have a model can use it, apparently the IF were heavy users during the HH and still have a few relics lying around, I hear you can take relic fellblades in 40k now, and thought it was a nice option, also having a superheavy tank in a marine army is kinda cool



they are difficult to balance.... teleport in, win initiative and engage and they'll give most stuff a good shoeing, however fail to activate them and they're useless, no token shooting no nothing, as they're the only deep strike option in the list, they need to be able to shoot and FF so they can deal with stuff like void spinners, so the all-rounder formation went back in



hmmm I wanted to stop the list turning into ultra-siege mode and this felt the sensible way to go about it, Krieg are limited in this manner



not that I can think of.... anyone else have any ideas?



that's the general idea!

marines give up a lot going on the defensive, so this list gives the options of bunkers etc, or you use turrets for area denial, bastions to hold objectives and then the rest of the force grinds forwards, also playing purely defensive lists is boring so the last thing I wanted was to create yellow siegers!

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Isn't "plus Transport" standard in all Marine lists (Official and NetEA and EUK) as you have the option of taking the Rhinos (or swapping them for Drop Pods where applicable) or not taking them (to garrison or T/Hawk etc) at army selection time.
The only difference with the EUK list is they allow the choice before each game.

I friggin hate them too, but like it or not they exist now, and if someone has gone to the trouble of converting some, they now have a thematic list to use them in



I don't think it's too cluttered, it's meant to be a unit so has ATSKNF and can shoot and engage, it's a bit different to regular fortifications



Dunno, ask Glyn, he suggested it and a few others agreed, from the little I've read, the IF are the legion most likely to still have a few functioning Fellblades.... it's statted and costed to be a fluff choice, it's by no means awful, but far far far from an auto-choice



I'm not going for the halfway approach, just trying to make it so you're not forced to go down the all-out siege route



actually no, I don't think they are yellow siegemasters.... siegemasters have the ability to sit and wait, absorb casualties, shell with artillery and take out war engines with shadowswords and deathstrikes, Marines defending in a siege have to take the 'attack is the best form of defence' approach, or they end up being attacked on the enemy's terms (prepped, outnumbered, clipped) which rarely works out well for them.... I think the only way to win with this kind of list is to be prepared to hit the enemy and disrupt them before they can get into position, and marines can't do that with massed shooting like guard

if you want to have full blown siege warfare with minefields and bunkers and marines in them, you can do it, because you can get free siegeworks for your units by swapping their rhinos, those of us who want to play a more defensively oriented marine list can do so as well

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Batrep added, apologies for the lack of pics... would have taken some but we were under threat of having to pack up and go due to Mike being on call for work, so we played fast and loose to make sure we were finished on time!

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Teleporting Assault Terminators would be to big a gamble for me. They need Thunderhawks or Land Raiders to do their stuff.

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Oh yeah, this list needs proper termies, assault termies are a real risk, especially when you have reduced ability to deep strike.... 5-6 test games with assault termies have proven that they're just not effective enough at dealing with a broad range of targets.... stuff like void spinners are a pain in the neck for this list

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Did anyone tried Assault Terminators in Land Raiders? Perhabs wiith upgrade of more Land Raiders for ablative transport space?

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Tried it once but it's an expensive formation in a list full of expensive formations.... plus you're limited in movement (can be blocked by scout screens and terrain) whereas teleporting termies can go right where you need them

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Surely this is the point - No?

As I understand it, the IF list being presented is a ** Specialist ** force intended to break fortifications and entrenched positions etc. Eldar don't do fortifications, they are all about mobility etc aren't they??? So by definition I would expect Assault Terminators to fare badly against a highly mobile skimmer force.

Now, fighting Barans, DCoK etc, I would expect these guys to rock . . . .

it's maybe slightly more specialised than the codex list but it's not a specialist list in that it's intended to require finesse playstyle with sub-optimal units.... plus the list is intended as a defensive one, able to hold a position, rather than a siegebreaking list... I'm developing the siege assault vanguard list for that purpose

As I said, from a balance POV, the list needed regular terminators, they have to do much of the heavy lifting in removing threats that the rest of the force can't reach.... Void Spinners, Manticores, super heavy tanks, titans etc... the standard stuff that marines struggle to deal with really.... the removal of thunderhawks means you need to use them more cleverly and they just don't have the flexibility of their air-assaulting brethren

In a list of specialists, you need a jack of all trades sometimes....

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Apologies for being dense, and not reading the full thread, but do tac formations get rhinos as standard in the 0.3 list? I see devs are listed as 'X units + transport', but tacs aren't.