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*Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
Brother-Captain Parzval
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 8:25 pm 
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Quote: (Man of kent @ 28 Jan. 2009, 17:14 )

I WOULD like to field something armor based; i even considered:
-Terminators
-Terminators
-Warhound
-Warhound
-T.bolts
-T.bolts
-Land Raiders
-Land Raiders +Hunter
-Tacticals +Supreme +Hunter +Razorback
-Scouts +razorback

Hey if you want to field that list, do it man! Show em your superior tactical skills by beating them with a supposedly inferior army selection  8v)

BTW good luck regardless of what your final choice is!




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Mephiston
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 8:25 pm 
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Was that at Open War 10? Cos if so I've got you down as playing guard?
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Mephiston
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 8:51 pm 
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4th. Now, you could have looked yourself by visiting the UK Epic Championship site, a link to which you will find in my singature  :agree:
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Chroma
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:23 pm 
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Quote: (Honda @ 28 Jan. 2009, 18:42 )

In Drop Pods
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread

I think you're one slot "over" on this, as the Strike Cruiser can only carry 20 units of Tacs/Dreads.

Also be aware that you won't be able to planetfall the Landing Craft in this set up.

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dptdexys
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 9:54 pm 
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Quote: (Honda @ 28 Jan. 2009, 18:42 )

This is my current list of choice. It hits pretty hard going in and
then keeps you on a wild ride the rest of the game.


A1
200 Strike Cruiser
350 Landing Craft

In Landing Craft
325 1 x Devastator, 1 x Librarian, 1 x Razorback
275 Vindicators
450 1 x Terminator, SupremeCommander

Teleport
350 1 x Terminator

In Drop Pods
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread
200 Thunderhawk

3000

I think the list is a few hundred points over. :agree:

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Jeridian
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 10:20 pm 
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Can't help you Man of Kent.

I started with mechanised Marines before I realised the official list is an Air Assault variant. I didn't have Thunderhawks yet, so it was Rhino mounted Tacticals, Predator support, Whirlwinds, etc.

As a result I bombed pretty pathetically at OW9.

Sad truth is, it's an Air Assault list. Other's have done amazingly with ground pounder Marines, but these are the exceptions that prove the rule. They're the tournament winners that would do well regardless of army, or even in spite of the army choices.
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Honda
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:20 pm 
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I think you're one slot "over" on this, as the Strike Cruiser can only carry 20 units of Tacs/Dreads.


H: Ouch! You are right. Bloody cut n' paste. I will fix that.

Also be aware that you won't be able to planetfall the Landing Craft in this set up

Actually, I never consider using Planetfall with my LC. However, I am curious. In looking at the rules, I don't seem to see what is preventing Planetfall. What should I be looking for, sensei?    :sigh:

I think the list is a few hundred points over

Yep, my bad again. I did not include the entry with the Strike Cruiser when I started the SUM function in Excel. I'll fix that.

Ok, thanx for the unintended review. The list now looks like:

200 Strike Cruiser
350 Landing Craft
In Landing Craft
325 1 x Devastator, 1 x Librarian, 1 x Razorback
275 Vindicators
450 1 x Terminator, SupremeCommander (on LC)
Teleport
350 1 x Terminator
In Drop Pods
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread
350 1 x Tacticals, 1 x Dread
300 1 x Tacticals

and it's now at 2950 (if my math is right), so I guess I'll add another character in. What do you think, a chappie with the teleporting termies?

Cheers, and sorry if I hijacked the thread.

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Mephiston
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:25 pm 
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When Chroma posted that I was curious too. The LC entry at the end says.... plus 6 thunderhawks and enough drop pods OR landing crafts to carry any remain units.

So by declaring 2 units to drop in pods only vehicles could be put in the LC.
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dptdexys
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 28, 2009 11:27 pm 
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and it's now at 2950 (if my math is right), so I guess I'll add another character in. What do you think, a chappie with the teleporting termies?


Or a captain in one of the drop pod tacticals so they could do a combined assault after podding if needed. :agree:

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Honda
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:14 am 
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Or a captain in one of the drop pod tacticals so they could do a combined assault after podding if needed


Ooh, ooh, ooh! I like that very much. Thank you for spotting that.

Cheers,

P.S.

and enough drop pods OR landing crafts to carry any remain units.

Me thinks that the "OR" means that I can take drop pods or LC in the strike cruiser, but not both. That seems surprising. I'll go back and look at that.




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Ginger
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 29, 2009 12:25 am 
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Interesting list Honda (BTW, I think you may still have problems - by my count, you are loading up 7x Rhino sized AVs onto the LC, which only takes 6x max, and the Strike Cruiser can only take 20x units, but you have 24 :laugh: ).
However, in principle you are dropping at least three formations into the teeth of the enemy with air support, having teleported the termies in first, right!?

It actually brings up the one thing missing from this discussion - what strategy to follow. This list is a fine example of an 'all-or-nothing' air drop army that is reliant on terrain, tactics and good local firepower to overcome a reasonable part of the opposing army through 'Shock and Awe'. A complete lack of air cover and AA is a bit of a gamble, depending on what opponents have. Other variants to this approach leave a token ground force to occupy the opposing troops or even to pin them while the airborne force clobbers a flank.

Actually, this is why I really like the Marines list, because there is so much variety in how it can be used - Matt O even won a tourney last year using a list that included the much maligned Predators (which is also worth a gander)




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Honda
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 29, 2009 1:48 am 
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I really should have posted my original tourney list, as I have really messed this thing up thinking I'd be cute with vindis and adding the termies to the LC. The earlier incarnation, teleported both termies and featured mostly tacticals...I apologize, this has really gone pear shaped. I really have been away too long.   :sigh:

Interesting list Honda (BTW, I think you may still have problems - by my count, you are loading up 7x Rhino sized AVs onto the LC, which only takes 6x max,


Aren't the Vindis four per and then one Razorback? That would be five, correct? What other vehicles are you referring to?

and the Strike Cruiser can only take 20x units, but you have 24

Well, I'm looking at my rule book now and it says, 12 of the following:...including termies and devestators... and in addition may take up to four landraiders or six of the rhino chassis.

I've got the Devestators (4) and one unit of terminators (counts as 8) for my 12 units and then the five vehicles (4 vindis + 1 razorback). It seems legal, is there an update to the Strike Cruiser stats?

However, in principle you are dropping at least three formations into the teeth of the enemy with air support, having teleported the termies in first, right!?

In the past (let's exclude my current list right now), I would identify where I wanted to control the local terrain and that's where the OB and drop pods would go. I would hit the units around that location as hard as I could, seeking to grab objectives as the final result. But the key was to reduce the ability of the opponent to counter attack in force. This phase could also apply to things like artillery parks that left unchecked could dominate the board.

I would then follow up with both terminators on an opposing force that could seriously threaten the drop force. The termies do a 1-2 punch to the gut and again, strive to reduce the ability to counter-attack.

The Landing Craft then flies in to either take on a third grouping somewhere near one or both of the other groups. Again, the goal is to degrade the opponenet's offensive capabilities.

In the meantime, I now have all of my stuff in the opponents backfield and my goals for the rest of the game are to continue to press what advantages I have. It is a very hard game to play because it is dependent on how successful the initial blows are. If they do well, then the aggressive follow up tends keep the opponent back pedaling the rest of the game.

It is intended to be a brutal application of force, but I love how it plays. It's so...me. 8v)

The more I think about the new list, the less I am liking my options because I have gone from three strike groups to 2.2 and that doesn't support the operational plan adequeately, like it has in the past.

I think I'll fiddle with this a little more and shape up the list a little better in preparation for some upcoming games.

It's good to air these things out with you guys.

Cheers,




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Chroma
 Post subject: *Sigh* Marines at Tourney?
PostPosted: Thu Jan 29, 2009 2:10 am 
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Quote: (Honda @ 28 Jan. 2009, 22:20 )

Actually, I never consider using Planetfall with my LC. However, I am curious. In looking at the rules, I don't seem to see what is preventing Planetfall. What should I be looking for, sensei?    :sigh:

My pupil, you cannot "Russian Doll" extra infantry units onto the Strike Cruiser by putting them "in" the Landing Craft.  The Strike Cruiser can transport a *maximum* of 20 infantry units (and/or Dreads), and then those 20 may be distributed in Drop Pods, Landing Craft, or Thunderhawks as desired and inserted via Planetfall.

If a Landing Craft/Thunderhawk is used as an "independent" air transport, then you can put in them what you wish.

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