You said 4 formations, not 4 formations of Stormravens hence my comments. Your clarification make WAYYYYYY more sense as to what you were intending to mean.


Well that's 2100 points (with Planetfall otherwise a turtled AA force would put the hurt on) so it should be shock'n'awe. Like all Air Assault in the game, it's going to be a polarized result, just more so.


NOW we're getting to the crux of the matter! Yeah I expect there's some room to play with the number of attacks on the Bloodstrike in testing.

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i should have made myself clearer the first time, .

I'd be in favour of 1 shot per turn, not one shot per missile and 4 missiles.

Same stats, same price.

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No worries, mate. That's why ask things

Yeah that could work as in reality they're going to get 4 turns in a game at max. Interesting idea. Again, all things to test.
[scribbles on notepad]

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I'd like to see the Blood Angels list tested and approved with only minimal changes, it's been tested a lot already and could probably be approved in short order if some of us get behind it and actually take the time to test and post up reports.

The only two changes I would like to see are:
Add Thunderhawk Transporters (the Blood Angels background and 40k codex is clear that they use them to drop vehicles directly into combat more than any other).
For once I agree with LoM - the Storm Raven should be reduced to 1 x rocket attack per turn. 4 x single shot is really excessive firepower (that makes the unit more powerful than it should be in comparison to other units) and even though each only actually has 4 rockets it's unlikely they will survive to fire more than 4 turns of shooting in epic anyway.

Assault should stay 6 strong base as a feature of the list. You can't fit multiple in a Thunderhawk, but on the hand get to have a nasty 8 strong formation or 6 + Dread. Death Company are fine too, no need of changes there.


Raptors are known for carrying special weapons (1-2 in a 5 man 40k unit) whereas Assault Marines traditionally don't. Hence why the Raptors have FF4+.

I agree with GlynG. The only question would be coordination with the Inquisitorial Champion (Still Dwarf Supreme, yes?) as ay change to Storm Ravens effects the GK.

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I agree with you, about the Stormraven -but I think 2 Bloodstrike missile/turn is a better solution -with 1/turn it will be over-expensive, and will disappear -only the DC will use it -because of the Dreads! So to keep it in game, it should be 2x Bloodstike missile/turn! Most of the games will last only for 3 turns -so do not count the 4th turn

The Assaults are still to expensive -next to the Raptors. The main problem is not the Raptors FF 4+, but the free Character (+MW attack), and the cheaper price -315p vs 325p. I don't suggest to have 4+ FF Assault Marines, but suggest a 25p cost reduction, which seems fair -to allow the players to rely more on this unit type -to be more fluffwise.

Altough the Thawk transporter is a good idea, it should not be included INSTEAD of the Assault cost reduction, or the Stormraven update -they are DIFFERENT updates!

And don't forget the planetfall restrictions -BA armies may have only 0-1 Spacecraft.
What about the 75p Baal Predators?

However, when you bump up the BA to 8 and add a commander and take into account ATSKNF then the price difference of 60 points (8 Raptors and Lord) is a pretty fair outcome. ATSKNF is a big difference when you look at a larger Marine formation. You need 16 BM to break them as a starting point (obviously less as they take casualties). Raptors need 8....

When you take into account their access to Air Assaults etc., this multiplies the impact of the BA.

I don't think their price should go down.

edit - At Heavy Bolter a BA Assault formation almost took down a Warlord with fire support from a Tactical formation. 6 Assault units are a pretty solid formation. it may not be the norm but it goes to show their resilience.

Yeah, but the BA army should be an Assault specialist -not an all-rounder army, like the Black Legion. 60p /UNIT -if you using more units of assaults, the difference is even more confusing!

Edit: You may be right, it's not the usual situation

Dobbsy is right on and speaks the truth. 16BM swallowing unit is nothing to dismiss. Raptors are totally fine.
The only reason I like an Assault reduction by 25 is to see more 8 unit BA Assault formations but they do work as is.


That's par course for lists so I am not sure what you're getting at there.

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"The BA army should be an Assault specialist."

And I don't disagree with you however, Epic is an abstraction - it doesn't need to be a straight translation by increasing formation numbers following a price drop. I see your point from the fluff perspective, however you just get that in the larger Assault formation size instead.

I think everyone has some points -I'm only for Assault Marines, because of the BA fluff. They are not regular Marines, not for example a devastator or artillery, terminator, etc. heavy army! They are the best damn CC army that the Adeptus Astartes have

16BM sounds powerful, but if you play with SM, your enemy is not the high number of broken formations -your enemies are the fully destroyed formations In case of Assault Marines, they are without any ranged weapon, and are quite vulnerable, til they reach base contact.

It shuold be playtested many times, I just have my own experiences!

Edit: Dobbsy, I totally agree with you, but every aspect of the upgrades sholud be tested! And while for example the Black Legion can be a Raptor or Tank, etc.. heavy army -there are very few chances to play diferent style of BA armies.. It's a highly specialised army list, and should be good at it's own business!

We will se the result of the tests -and it really doesn't matter- I still like painting these little red armoured guys

Fair point. However, again, this is Epic. It's not just a straight translation. Their special rules also reflect this view.

Understood, but they also have ways to get to those Engagements that gives them some distinct advantages and power.

Agreed. Get to it then! Also please have your opponents make comments for balance of feedback.

Since this list doesn't have a Sub-AC anymore what are we going to do with focusing on the same set of changes here?

I'm happy to kick out a document containing the THawk transporter added if needed.
The Storm Raven is a different story as that effects the Inquisitorial lists as well. [turns to glorious leadership]

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How do you mean "same set of changes" Jimmy?

If people think it's necessary then we can look to add it to the 2014 compendium update.

I'd like to get E&C's view on this too. As he wrote the list, I'm keen to know why he left it out.

This thread is discussing the addition of the THawk Transporter and I thought you were onboard with that?

edit: DOH! That was GlynnG. Sorry I'm having a senior moment.

also for clarification I was meaning "to test in isolation if a thawk transporter and /or single shot Storm Raven are worth exploring further and report back. Not meaning for anything in the official 2.12 list to be changed. Hopefully that was clear (and if not, is now)

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