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Camera advice sought....

 Post subject: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 8:09 pm 
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+++Not sure if this is the right place to post this, Mods, feel free to move if needed+++

Hi guys,

Looking to purchase an SLR camera, and one of my criteria is that it needs to be able to take decent close ups of my minis, as I've been wanting to start my own 'hobby blog' for ages.

Anyone got any advice on makes/models/features to look out for, or even avoid for that matter.

Thanks in advance all!

Cheers
Reedar


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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 8:21 pm 
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I'm a fan of Nikons. Good lenses.

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 9:06 pm 
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Kodak-take a mini into a store and test the macro setting on a few different models and get them to show the results on a pc screen.


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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 9:40 pm 
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I use a Nikon Coolpix - not an SLR, but useful for my needs. Canon EOS I've heard very good things about, though they are pricey.

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 10:02 pm 
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The cannon Rebel is a good SLR. I've got an EOS20D and the rebel can hold it's own against it. Much cheaper than their pro line too.

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2011 11:21 pm 
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Cheers guys.

In terms of macro functions, should I look for an additional lense, or just the built in functions with the camera?


Canon EOS range seems to crop up a lot in my searches, and with some deals out there at the mo, it's what I'm leaning t'ward.....


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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 9:25 am 
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Definitely an additional macro lens.

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 10:29 am 
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Cheers E&C, when the wife questions the additional expenditure, I'll say it was all your fault! ;)


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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 10:42 am 
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Also eBay is a good source for 2nd hand good lenses.

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 10:45 am 
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Just to throw a different view out there -

If you're looking to take photos of miniatures purely for the aim of posting them online, its far more down to the lighting than the camera. This doesn't apply so much if you're publishing in print, but I've still had good results...

These days Most cameras can take a good photo of models for online use, but not all lighting setups will display the miniatures in a good enough way for any camera to capture.

I use a relatively old Olympus C765 UZ. Its a fixed lens, 4 megapixel camera. Now, it does have a remarkably good macro range for its age - it can focus to within 2 inches - but I dont use it.

What I do have is a tripod, fresh white backing card and a very good twin bar Daylight lamp.

What you have to remember is that to post pictures online, you'll have to crop them down and re-size them considerably. Thats why pixel count isn't that important. You're only going to end up using a tiny percentage of what you can take with.

As a side note, I try to keep my website photos below 150kb.

Thus the Macro lens point. It comes down to practice, but you can take a photo from some distance back, as long as the photos are within the focal depth of the shot. It doesn't matter if you then crop half the photo away - you wouldn't be able to post it all online anyway, and it just means you dont have to re-size the picture quite so drastically.

The important bit is that the whole of the model is well lit (mine is the predecessor to this: http://uk.daylightcompany.com/product/d ... amp-32500/ ) , and that the camera is steady ( any tripod - I'm about to replace mine, but my existing was out of a jumble sale 7 years ago so not in a position to make a suggestion there!).

All said, the best bit of advice is to take something in and do some test shots with every camera you try.

And I suppose I should include some shots I've taken with my old, well lit system -

This page is full of 6mm photos, including detail shots of individual 6mm infantry figures - I'll stick my neck out and say they're about as crisp as you'll see anywhere... ;)
http://hobbybrush.com/scifi/6mmsow/displaykrayt/

Of course, a better camera may still help, and certainly would for publication. Happy snapping!

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 12:22 pm 
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Pretty much what Paul said.

In terms of brands, pretty much any well known camera manufacturer will do. Canon, Olympus, Nikon, Leica, and more recently Sony and Panasonic. If buying a pocket camera, make sure it has a macro setting (ie. small tulip icon).

Like Paul said, a DSLR may be overkill for online stuff, if that is all you plan to use the camera for. Personally I own both an Olympus DSLR with a macro lens, and a smaller Leica pocket cam. I find myself using the Leica more often as it is often handier when I just need to snap some quick photos and post online. Remember: It is entirely possible to shoot crappy photos with an expensive camera if you don't know what you are doing, just like you can make good pictures with a cheap/old camera, if you know it well.
It is rare that I bother setting up a proper light rig, so often I just shoot the minis using flash - usually a big nono in miniature photography, but knowing how the flash lights up the image frame I can place the miniatures accordingly and usually get decent results, good enough for online use.

Go DSLR if you plan to photograph a lot in general. Especially outdoors stuff with plenty of detail as the image quality is superb due to the extra light through larger lenses, and larger image sensors of DSLRs. If you know what you're doing, the manual features of a DSLR also gives you a lot more creative freedom. Personally I rarely ever use the automated settings on mine, as I've come to know my camera well.

A pocket camera has the advantage of being compact. It is more usefull for carrying with you to parties and stuff where you wouldn't normally be dragging a bulky and expensive DSLR with you. Remember: The best camera is the one you always carry with you, to capture those special moments. A pocket camera is also quite adequate for most online work when it comes to miniature photograpny.


But as Paul said: The key feature is setting up good lighting. Ideally you'd want at least two lights (3 if you feel ambitious) to cancel out any shadows on the miniature. You'd also need a good backdrop that reflects light back on the miniature, but doesn't upset your camera's light metering and white balance too much: Too dark background and your miniature becomes over-exposed. Entirely white, and your miniatures become too dark. Lighter backgrounds are better though, as you can salvage a dark photo in an image editing program. This is not possible with an overexposed photo. Ideally you want a background that is the equivalent of 50% gray. But technically it can be any color (Imagine if you had a blue background and photographed in black/white: The grey color you'd get should be roughly 50% gray).

You can print your own background.The blue to white gradient backgrounds you see in many miniature photograps aren't necessarily digitally additions. The gradient works a bit like the horizon on a landscape image, and makes it easier for the camera to automatically select the proper exposure and color settings.

That said, you'd usually want to go back and edit your images a bit afterwards. It is usually necessary to adjust the brightness and color balance slightly, and you'd need to crop and compress the images for online use anyway. 150kb is a good standard size to aim for. I tend to compress to about 60% which keeps the image quality fairly good. Personally I like large images, but bear in mind what can actually be displayed on screen in a browser. There's no reason to make an image more than 1500 pixels wide (Well unless your're making an army shot and want people to be able to zoom in on every model ;) )



edit: Oh, and a word on the miniatures themselves: Remember there's a difference between what you THINK you see, and what you actually see. When you've spent time painting a miniature you know the shapes and color very well and have formed a mental image of it in your mind. This means that you sometimes become blind to what sort of photos you actually take of the piece. You know what it is supposed to look like, so your mind makes up for the information you cannot see in the picture. But to an outside viewer this is not clear at all. (We are in fact very reliant on what we EXPECT to see, and do not very often actually look at things. If I paint a potato blue with some red, yellow and white on it, you'll have no idea what it is, untill I tell you it is supposed to be an Ultramarine, but after that, all you will see is a (somewhat amorphous) member of the Adeptus Astartes).

It doesn't make it any easier that your eyesight is stereoscopic, and the camera is not. Take your time and find the best angle for the shot, that gives the best imperssion of the shape. Sometimes it is only a few degrees that makes all the difference. Of course there are times when you need more images to really do a miniature justice. But the point is, that even if you know that a miniature looks good, it may be poorly recieved if you photograph it from a poor angle. And of course: Choosing a dramatic angle, that really captures the essence of a miniautre will really bring it to life!

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 1:36 pm 
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Cheers for all the responses guys, in particular to Tuffskull and WN for taking the time to offer that advice too.

I do own a Canon SX130 (compact digital camera) and spent last night looking at the manual for it*. Discovered is does have the macro function (ye olde tulip icon) so think I'll play around taking some shots with that to see if they're adequate for online use.

I do like getting out and about in the countryside so want something which will take decent shots anyway, but think I'll wait until closer to the summer before making the purchase.

Does anyone know if there is a digital copy of the blue/white gradiant background that I can print a copy of?

Cheers again

Reedar



*I spent 10 mins establishing I have no idea where I've put it, followed by 1 min downloading a new copy from Canons website.....


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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Sat Dec 31, 2011 5:40 pm 
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TuffSkull wrote:
Just to throw a different view out there -
If you're looking to take photos of miniatures purely for the aim of posting them online, its far more down to the lighting than the camera.


I couldn't agree more. A tripod is really useful as well.

Just google for gradients. Tons of backgrounds came up here.

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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 8:02 am 
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I have a similar camera to yours, a Canon SX200, damaged and recently replaced by an SX230. My wife has a Nikon d70 SLR. Stick with the SX130.

I prefer compact cameras for macro shots (and only for macro shots, to be honest). The smaller sensor means they have a greater depth of field - more stuff is in focus, so no blurry background which makes portrait shots look so nice. That's good with macro shots. With an SLR, you're more likely to get only a sliver of the mini in focus and everything else out of focus.

Canon's SX line is great because it gives you full manual controls. To get a clear shot you really must shoot at ISO 80 or 100. Unless your lights are very bright, that means it'll be a slow shot. If you need more than 1 second, then you have to do it in Manual mode. Set the aperture to the smallest number (wider aperture) and then adjust the shutter speed until the exposure is right. The camera's exposure meter can only be trusted if most of the photo is of a neutral tone - so use a light-medium gray background, not white nor black. (If you use a white background, you'll need more exposure - a brighter photo - than the camera recommends).

You will need a tripod, and you'll have to turn off Image Stabilization when using it (at least with the earlier SX models). Light-duty tripods cost as little as $20, and Gorillapods are a $15 alternative. Spend the money on lights and a lightbox, or reflectors.


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 Post subject: Re: Camera advice sought....
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2012 9:54 am 
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I just got a Nikon coolpix p500. I cannot work out how to get the correct depth of field though so half the minis are in focus and the rest are out of focus. (I think the DOF is about 8cm on autofocus - but that isn't enough).

Does anyone have any tips on how to adjust Depth of Field? This thing seems to only have an f/stop of 3.4 to 8.0...


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