It is problamatic that the only way to price these effectively is to use values not divisable by 25... The Chimerro would be better than a standard Chimaera (extra 45cm AP5+/AT6+ most likely) but not 25 points better. Maybe +10pt. Chimerax is definitely 25pt better. Chimedon is probably 20pt better, but not as good as the Chimerax, IMO.

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SG

Ghost's Paint Blog, where everything goes that isn't something else.

The best way to point them would probably be with fixed upgrade costs, for example "add 5 Chimmeraxes for +xx points".

That's if we decide to go down that route.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

I agree. When the Chimera was introduced to Epic, only Tech Guard could have them.

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"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart

E&C's vote thread is here:

viewtopic.php?f=22&t=20950

While we are at it, are there any units that could really go or need changed in the skitarii list? Ones that stick out to me are the rapier and mole mortar as well as the spacecraft.

The first issue I have with the mole mortars and rapiers is that they are 5cm slower than the infantry. Both do seem to have some use with the mole mortar giving you indirect fire and the rapier another source of AT fire. Looking at the mole mortars first, you only get four dice and you have to sustain to have decent range. Since they are attached to the demi-centuries, it kinda kills the effect since you'd probably want to sustain against something your entire detachment can shoot at and there are better options for longer ranged shooting on the minorus. The rapier seems a little better since it gives a little AT punch to the demi-century but I don't think I've ever found a use for them that wouldn't be points better spent elsewhere or seen them show up in any battle reports. I'm thinking that the mole mortar could almost be dropped entirely and the rapiers upgraded for a bit more speed and maybe dropped in cost by 25 points. I realize that's a pretty substantial change but it might help make the choice between the rapiers and something else more thought provoking. Alternatively both could be dropped to allow the fire support option to be based around the chimera variants that are likely to show up in hte next version.

The other thing (not just a problem with AdMech) is that I don't think anyone uses the spacecraft and, at least for admech, the cost to purchase the models is pretty substantial for the battleship the Ark is based on. I'm almost think that both could be dropped especially if they can't be made more attractive since there's nothing worse than having an expensive model that is useless compared to cheaper alternatives (both list wise and in terms of monetary investment.)

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-Vaaish

Mole Mortars and Rapiers could become support formations?

The Gothic Class Cruiser is super excellent.

The Ark Mechanicus could be dropped to 150pts?

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

I don't think that would work too well for them to become support formations. There's already a whole lot of options in the support section and a good number of alternatives to the Rapiers that would perform a little more effectively.

Perhaps just drop the ark completely? I really don't think it's necessary to have two spacecraft, especially when one is only slightly better than a lunar and has slow and steady tacked on with a hefty price tag for its trouble. Combined with the cost of the physical model, I don't see anyone really taking it over the gothic if the points were dropped.

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-Vaaish

You can proxy any old spacecraft as an Ark, in practice.

125pts?

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

True, but honestly, would you take a pinpoint attack and a 6bp MW barrage that has to be targeted before the game and can't be used until turn three over 2x pinpoint attacks that can arrive any turn and can choose their targets? Even for 25 points less? About the only thing the Ark has going for it is the model, which is expensive. It really doesn't fill any niche in the army. Of all the options that one is the one that seems to exist just for the sake of being there.

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-Vaaish

100pts?

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Sorry, I think the sentinels still win out in utility I did feel a slight twinge for a half second though.

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-Vaaish

100pts it is then. It's not going to be removed.

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Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

I think the basic spaceship is an excellent choice myself; I was planning on taking it as standard in my army lists and bought a Ad-Mech cruiser specially.

What's not to love about 2 x 2+ TK(D3) attacks anywhere on the table on the first turn? I regard that as a bargain for 150!

The Ark Mechanicus could definitely do with a boost though. I'm not sure it should go to from 300 all the way down to 100 though as that sounds too cheapm plus it's cheaper than the standard cruiser and that just seems wrong somehow, though at the end of the day I guess it doesn't really matter. I'd think about boosting its firepower as well as dropping its point to 150-250ish - add a second pinpoint attack as well or increase the BP a little maybe?

The PDF spells Ark Mechanicus with a C instead of a K.

An Ark Mechanicus should, by my count, have 2 pin point attacks (one side's lances, plus the dorsal lances) and 5BP (maximum weapon batteries in side arc divided by 2), by my count.

That would seem as valuable as the Gothic.

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