AA-tank (and AA-defiler) <3

No AA-obi <3

I like a lot!

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Eradication of Earth's
Population loves Polaris

Its a question for you PG, way back when they outclassed thunderbolts for us (never tried vs Orks).

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'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x

The Chaos aircraft are supposed to outclass Imperial planes so how is that a problem? At least this is what the fluff tells us that

IIRC those original stats that you appear to be referencing are not the same as these correct? If so, why are we discussing some past problem?

I'm going to try them out in a game or two. Maybe you can and share your results?

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Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.

TRC's complaint aside, the past practice has been to not use random shots and instead stick with the average.

I think its a bit lame (whats one more dice when you're rolling tons already?) and takes away some of the fun of the Chaos list but it is a pretty establish pattern and we should grudginly follow it.

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Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.

They are the same stats, I've consistently said the same thing and tested the same thing for donkeys now.

News to me they are better than Imperial planes, I thought they had less armour and firepower but more manoeuvrability and were loosely modelled on the zero. However if they are better the twin 30cm 5+ (4+ on intercept) is the way to go.

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If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com!
'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x

One quick question

1) What formations can we add the Stalker to? Or should we use it as we see fit and then provide feedback?

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Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.

I actually don't ever recall seeing you post a battle report or series of comments on these aircraft. Can you post a link to where you have done this so I can go back and reread them as I obviously missed them earlier.

And if you do have actual game experience to fall back on then why not use that instead of making these mathematical or theoretical comments about the units? Surely this would be better to do since you see people make almost constant reference for a need for this sort of feedback.

But in any case, there are a lot of new stats and tweaks here so, one more time, why not test them and get back to people?

Surely, if you are right then a few test games will provide you with ample evidence of this and you can finally get the changes that you want to the units.

Mind you, after going on about how darned good you are with aircraft I guess we need to take your game results with a pinch of salt   Can't ahve you expert players skewing the results now can we  

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Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.

I think I did say everyone else seems just as good and better now at tournies and my pristine air record has been shot down in flames

As for the maths bit I simply don't get that on lots of forums. If a unit is better its better. Given everything else being equal simply upping the numbers makes something better. So you go back to is it supposed to be (apparently they do have more firepower than Imperials so check) and then you make a guess at the points to say what they should be and test to find out if you are right.

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If using E-Bay use this link to support Tac Com!
'Abolish red trousers?! Never! Red trousers are France!' – Eugene Etienne, War Minister, 1913
"Gentlemen, we may not make history tomorrow, but we shall certainly change the geography."
General Plumer, 191x

I agree with TRC, all things being  equal better numbers are better in a game about rolling dice based on numbers regardless of how you use them.

Any aircraft that can intercept needs short ranges in Epic with 30cm as the max, bombers can have 45cm since it wont be as broken.

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Fear is for the enemy, fear and bullets.
-James O'Barr, the Crow

Broken?

Its hardly broken.

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Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.

I think what TRC is trying to get at is that Hellblades* are (according to background) are slightly worstin armament than thunderbolts and not as durable, but make up for this by having more numbers in the air.

However these stats outgun the current Thunderbolt.

Now the problem is with the current Thunderbolt rather than the 'blade.  Alas the Thunderbolt's stats are in the main rule book and should be used as a base line, so the 'blades stats should be based around them, not what the model has.

So if the Thuinderbolt had its quad autocannons (dual twin autocannons) and twin las cannons then the stats for the 'blade looks fine, but in its current incarnation then the 'blade needs to be down graded.


*and and 'talon and harbinger

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Tyranid air marshal

I really don't see how this is relevant at all.

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Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.

Because the already established Rulebook aircrafts are not true-gun. So why should be the weapons on aircrafts for newer lists?

If we follow the Rulebook example the Hellblade would have a single Reaper Autocannon with front fire arc (perhabs all around for the same reasons as Orks) nothing more. The Helltalon would have 1BP for it's bombs and a single (non-Reaper) Autocannon all with FxF.

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We are returned!
http://www.epic-wargaming.de/

This isn't any reason to modify the stats of the Hell Talon.

If it performs too well in playtest games then that is one thing. I don't recall there being any sort of consensus from the test reports that were posted regarding the unit so there remains little reason to change the weapon load and if it was going to be changed I'd like to think it was for game balance reasons and not because someone screwed up the weapon load for the TBolt.

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Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.