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let us change the cost for harridan
Napalm
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 1:01 pm 
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(darkangel @ Aug. 07 2007,11:12)
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the ork player gave our tyranid player 1.000 from his contingent. so our tyranid player could shop for 5.000 points...9 harridan = 1.350 points. probably now he has 12 harridan and this works too. so i keep my opinion 200 points for 1 harridan is not too much. and this will reduce the quantity automatic. i think it is the wrong way to give an army a limit in using some models. in my point of view the cost should rule this automatic, too!

I disagree for 3 things:
-why would netepic would get new rules just for one of your opponent?
A stupid exemple: what if buy tons of fleshounds and make a stupid army with bloodthirster along with 5 fleshound units? could be cheap:
One bloodthirster = 300 points
25 fleshounds = 500 points.
For 8000 points I put 10 bloodthirster and 250 fleshounds on the table, and i'm sure it can make a big mess!
The fleshounds aren't too cheap or overpowered, that's ?just a stupid way to play.
So basicaly you can raise prices of everything.

-the ork give points to the tyranids? => Tyranids with allies? I don't like this.

-shot down that stupid harridans with your devastators. They"re not so powerful (and yeah he's cheating if he uses regeneration for everything).
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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 1:22 pm 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 08 2007,11:41)
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I should slap myself for being so slow....but nowhere in the NE5.0 Tyranid list does it say Harridans Regenerate!

oh good zap...i am so sorry...you are right, harridans could not regenerate...we have only looked at the wounds and we thought that they can regenerate, because all other units with wounds can...so do not have read to the end...you are right, they have not the ability regeneraration!!!!!!!!!

ok, forget what i have said...150 points is ok for them!

who can read has a big advantage :D
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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 1:39 pm 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 08 2007,11:41)
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hey zap, i received a message to my email account where you wrote:

"Oh, and an Overlord at 250 points using the new rules is still a good deal, and the company is great! At high altitude they effectively have 6 shots at 100cms and 4 shots at 75cm....all for a measly 250 points!!!"

but now i can not find this article anymore??????
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zap123
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 3:58 pm 
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I deleted it 'cause it was probably just noise.  I do like my Overlord though and I think it will be fine under the new rules....it was far too strong before.

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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 4:05 pm 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 07 2007,00:57)
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one more question:

the regenerating ability says:
...When a regenerating unit fails an Armor Save, turn the model on its side and treat it as dead...Shots against a downed creature hit automatically but armor saves are made normally...

this would mean, that a harridan would go down, if his first armor save fails, right?...but i thought that he would only go down, if he has at least 3 wounds?!

this would not apply to the bio titans, because this situation is described in the army book of tyranids seperatly, right? and what about the situation with CC with units on the ground? only CAF to defend?

and what about the harridans bombs? he must throw them in a straight line and they do not have to overlap, right?
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scream
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 4:11 pm 
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The regeneration you're talking about is for Khorne bloodletters or trolls (regeneration ability but no wound), I does not apply to wound regeneration.

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Napalm
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2007 7:05 pm 
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(darkangel @ Aug. 08 2007,16:05)
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and what about the harridans bombs? he must throw them in a straight line and they do not have to overlap, right?

They must touch each others, it is specified with a diagram in the old hivewar book.

BTW, in this book it has the right to make a full infiltration charge (50cm).
In netepic it is "After setup, Infantry & Walkers may move on Charge, others move normal distance" So the harridan seems to be "other". You see, is even less powerfull than in the old game :D
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zap123
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 1:40 am 
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(darkangel @ Aug. 08 2007,16:05)
QUOTE

(zap123 @ Aug. 07 2007,00:57)
QUOTE

one more question:

the regenerating ability says:
...When a regenerating unit fails an Armor Save, turn the model on its side and treat it as dead...Shots against a downed creature hit automatically but armor saves are made normally...

this would mean, that a harridan would go down, if his first armor save fails, right?...but i thought that he would only go down, if he has at least 3 wounds?!

this would not apply to the bio titans, because this situation is described in the army book of tyranids seperatly, right? and what about the situation with CC with units on the ground? only CAF to defend?

and what about the harridans bombs? he must throw them in a straight line and they do not have to overlap, right?

I think the "Multiple Wounds" rule in the Core Rulebook should answer your questions pretty clearly. ?So the multi-wound critter only "falls down" once it has lost all its wounds. ? Once down, shots auto hit, and in CC the "dead" critter rolls no dice and loses a wound for every point it loses the CC by.

Napalm is right, in the old rules it implied they had to touch.  However, in NetEpic 5.0 neither the Harridan rules nor the "Drop Things" rule state the templates have to touch. ?They do have to be centred on the line of travel though.  I don't know whether this was deliberate or an ommission, but personally I don't really see any big deal about them having to touch.




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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 5:09 am 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 09 2007,01:40)
QUOTE

(darkangel @ Aug. 08 2007,16:05)
QUOTE

(zap123 @ Aug. 07 2007,00:57)
QUOTE

one more question:

the regenerating ability says:
...When a regenerating unit fails an Armor Save, turn the model on its side and treat it as dead...Shots against a downed creature hit automatically but armor saves are made normally...

this would mean, that a harridan would go down, if his first armor save fails, right?...but i thought that he would only go down, if he has at least 3 wounds?!

this would not apply to the bio titans, because this situation is described in the army book of tyranids seperatly, right? and what about the situation with CC with units on the ground? only CAF to defend?

and what about the harridans bombs? he must throw them in a straight line and they do not have to overlap, right?

I think the "Multiple Wounds" rule in the Core Rulebook should answer your questions pretty clearly. ?So the multi-wound critter only "falls down" once it has lost all its wounds. ? Once down, shots auto hit, and in CC the "dead" critter rolls no dice and loses a wound for every point it loses the CC by.

Napalm is right, in the old rules it implied they had to touch. ?However, in NetEpic 5.0 neither the Harridan rules nor the "Drop Things" rule state the templates have to touch. ?They do have to be centred on the line of travel though. ?I don't know whether this was deliberate or an ommission, but personally I don't really see any big deal about them having to touch.

...ok, but the harridan has to fly a straight line when moving, right?
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zap123
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 6:11 am 
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Ah no, the Harridan is a Floater, not a flyer.  It can move normally.

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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 8:21 am 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 09 2007,06:11)
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Ah no, the Harridan is a Floater, not a flyer. ?It can move normally.

hard, so as a synapse the harridan can move doubble (50cm!) and throw his bombs zigzag on his fly?

And if he doesn`t has to put his bombs side by side, then he will put them overlap to cover the maximum of infantry, right?
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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 1:30 pm 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 09 2007,06:11)
QUOTE

hi zap...and one more question...

do you know if the "harridan" and the "tyranid warriors" have the ability "command" and netepic just forgot to give them?

our tyranid player guess that they have, because both are synapse and synapse can give orders to broods so this would mean, that a unit which has to give orders themselves can give other units some too...

can you take a stand?
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zap123
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Thu Aug 09, 2007 4:58 pm 
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Synapse does not equal Command.  Neither of these units had Command in the old days.  If it doesn't say Command in the Unit summary then they don't have it.  

A lot fewer units have Command these days....look at the Eldar list.  Five full armies in one book and there are the grand total of 3 units with Command!!!!!

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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 5:53 am 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 09 2007,16:58)
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Synapse does not equal Command. ?Neither of these units had Command in the old days. ?If it doesn't say Command in the Unit summary then they don't have it. ?

A lot fewer units have Command these days....look at the Eldar list. ?Five full armies in one book and there are the grand total of 3 units with Command!!!!!

ok, that was my point of view too. i will tell him!

so now the harridan could only move advance range (normal 25 cm) to throw his bombs but that he can do zigzag during his move, right? there must no straight line of his fly and his bombs can overlap if he wants it, right too?

it s great, tomorrow we have out meeting to discuss he whole things. thanks that you have answered all questions so accurate and fast. i think all our problems are removed "the day afer tomorrow" :glare:
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darkangel
 Post subject: let us change the cost for harridan
PostPosted: Fri Aug 10, 2007 11:35 am 
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(zap123 @ Aug. 09 2007,16:58)
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Synapse does not equal Command. ?Neither of these units had Command in the old days. ?If it doesn't say Command in the Unit summary then they don't have it. ?

A lot fewer units have Command these days....look at the Eldar list. ?Five full armies in one book and there are the grand total of 3 units with Command!!!!!

hey zap...but if you have to give the harridan and tyrand warrior orders, then they are independet, right? but they do not have the ability...the ability synapse do not say anything about acting them.

i can not find any indication, how you use a synapse expecting if you add command, as for the dominatrix or hive queen. and so you can too, if you add independend to the harridan and tyranid warrior!
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