Thunderhawks on "first fire" order |
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jb1
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order  Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2006 4:45 am |
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...if a thunderhawk is on fist fire order,moving to an LZ,drops troops,stays put as required,does the TH now fire it's weapons?
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Enderel
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2006 8:02 am |
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After dropping off it's troops on the previous turn I would suggest that the Thunderhawk can be put on first fire in the next turn. Turn 1 - Drop troops, turn 2 + - First Fire.
I would count this as a skimmer for the purposes of attacking ?and being attacked. ?This to me would be the equivalent of a Huey hovering around the LZ offering cover support.
So I would say yes it can fire all it's weapons.
If you mean all in the same turn then no the Thunderhawk cannot be on first fire as it is counted as being at ground level after dropping troops. ?It can only fire it's point defence weapons.
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Dwarf Supreme
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2006 3:08 pm |
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I agree with Enderel's answers.
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jb1
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Thu Jun 08, 2006 11:55 pm |
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... so only the Bolters may fire while on "first fire',and during the marine deployment?
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... there is nothing like the smell of bolter burned wraithbone armour in the morning....it smells like...like Victory!
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Enderel
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 7:59 am |
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If you charge or advance order the thunderhawk on the turn you wish to deploy then it drops to ground level to unload the troops. ?As long as you leave a proportional amount of movement, the marines can unload on the same turn as the thunderhawk moves onto or around the battlefield.
e.g. Turn 1 - Thunderhawk (basic 100cm move) with tactical marines onboard moves onto the battlefield on charge orders. ?It moves 180cm to get behind the enemy army. ?As it has only moved 9/10th's of it's movement the marines whilst deploying can move 1/10th of their movement, 1cm during the deployment. ?As it's on charge orders it cannot fire any weapons. ?
If it used advance orders it would drop to the ground to deploy the marines and then count as grounded so it can only fire it's point defence weapons.
Turn 2 - Thunderhawk stays around in the area to offer fire support and goes onto first fire.
I think that the deployment of any troops counts as a partial move so cannot be really combined with first fire for a flyer unit. ?Unless they are jump pack troops who can bail out under there own steam whilst the thunderhawk circles.
There use to be a minimum move for Thunderhawks not sure that this exists in NetEpic?
Read the rules slightly closer and found some interpretations I made on the rules had been from Second edition rules not just NetEpic rules.
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jb1
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 10:53 am |
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...according to the rules (special) regarding flyers,they may be under "first fire' order. This simulates them flying evasivly -"1 to hit" to anything firing at them. According to the rules they may then disembark the troops,and then fire its weapons if capable. Now,it doesn't specify "which" weapons or what is capable. There really seems to be a "void" here...
After thinking about it,if I will use thunderhawks in the future I will put them on advance orders ,land,disembark,and fire...
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... there is nothing like the smell of bolter burned wraithbone armour in the morning....it smells like...like Victory!
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Enderel
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 11:24 am |
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Umm just reading the rules a bit closer.. and my last comment was based on second edition rules not NetEpic sorry for the confusion!
Ok my interpretation of the NetEpic rules pg 17 is that no matter what order the unit is on turn of the disembarkation of troops they can only use point defence weapons. This is due to the fact they count as being grounded.
I think that they could still use advance or charge orders to come in and drop off troops and then use first fire to remain in the area on following turns.
Primarch will be able to clarify, but I think that was the intent of the rules.
Or you could use the option flier rules for straffing and dogfighting if you'd like from the optional rules pdf file.
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jb1
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:53 pm |
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| Quote (Enderel @ 09 June 2006 (11:24)) | Ok my interpretation of the NetEpic rules pg 17 is that no matter what order the unit is on turn of the disembarkation of troops they can only use point defence weapons. ?This is due to the fact they count as being grounded.
Primarch will be able to clarify, but I think that was the intent of the rules.
Or you could use the option flier rules for straffing and dogfighting if you'd like from the optional rules pdf file. |
...now I'm referring to Netepic 4.1, pg 15 Special rule: Flyers,Floaters,and AA units.
It has nothing about point weapons as the only weapons to be able to engage...
...pg 17 has nothing about what you are stating. Do we have the same rules?
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... there is nothing like the smell of bolter burned wraithbone armour in the morning....it smells like...like Victory!
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primarch
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Fri Jun 09, 2006 8:59 pm |
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| Quote (jb1 @ 09 June 2006 (15:53)) | | Quote (Enderel @ 09 June 2006 (11:24)) | Ok my interpretation of the NetEpic rules pg 17 is that no matter what order the unit is on turn of the disembarkation of troops they can only use point defence weapons. ?This is due to the fact they count as being grounded.
Primarch will be able to clarify, but I think that was the intent of the rules.
Or you could use the option flier rules for straffing and dogfighting if you'd like from the optional rules pdf file. |
...now I'm referring to Netepic 4.1, pg 15 Special rule: Flyers,Floaters,and AA units.
It has nothing about point weapons as the only weapons to be able to engage...
...pg 17 has nothing about what you are stating. Do we have the same rules? |
Hi!
There were changes from 4.1 to the current 5.0 rules.
According to the 5.0 rules first fire orders permit the flier to fly in, land, disembark troops and ONLY fire point defense weapons and NO other.
On advance orders it may fly around the area and fire all its weapons.
While its landed its a sitting duck.
Hope this helps.
Primarch
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Charysh
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 1:53 am |
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Primarch, your last comment clarifies the question, but leaves it a little vague on the issue of the bolters (According to the 5.0 rules first fire orders permit the flier to fly in, land, disembark troops and ONLY fire point defense weapons and NO other.)
The question now is do the point defense weapons fire as if on 'First Fire order' or do they fire in the advance fire segment?
(jb1's gaming partner  )
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jb1
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 2:30 am |
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| Quote (primarch @ 09 June 2006 (20:59)) | | Quote (jb1 @ 09 June 2006 (15:53)) | | Quote (Enderel @ 09 June 2006 (11:24)) | Ok my interpretation of the NetEpic rules pg 17 is that no matter what order the unit is on turn of the disembarkation of troops they can only use point defence weapons. ?This is due to the fact they count as being grounded.
Primarch will be able to clarify, but I think that was the intent of the rules.
Or you could use the option flier rules for straffing and dogfighting if you'd like from the optional rules pdf file. |
...now I'm referring to Netepic 4.1, pg 15 Special rule: Flyers,Floaters,and AA units.
It has nothing about point weapons as the only weapons to be able to engage...
...pg 17 has nothing about what you are stating. Do we have the same rules? |
Hi!
There were changes from 4.1 to the current 5.0 rules.
According to the 5.0 rules first fire orders permit the flier to fly in, land, disembark troops and ONLY fire point defense weapons and NO other.
On advance orders it may fly around the area and fire all its weapons.
While its landed its a sitting duck.
Hope this helps.
Primarch |
...thanks Primarch! I just downloaded Netepic 5.0. Everything is muc more clear than the 4.0 version. Thanks for all the past few clarifications. I'm sure we will bw posting for more of your knowledge in the near future.
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... there is nothing like the smell of bolter burned wraithbone armour in the morning....it smells like...like Victory!
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primarch
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Sat Jun 10, 2006 5:27 pm |
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Hi!
I highly recommend the 5.0 rules. The format and clarifications are MUCH better than 4.1.
Primarch
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jb1
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Post subject: Thunderhawks on "first fire" order Posted: Wed Jun 14, 2006 8:57 pm |
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| Quote (Charysh @ 10 June 2006 (01:53)) | Primarch, your last comment clarifies the question, but leaves it a little vague on the issue of the bolters (According to the 5.0 rules first fire orders permit the flier to fly in, land, disembark troops and ONLY fire point defense weapons and NO other.)
The question now is do the point defense weapons fire as if on 'First Fire order' or do they fire in the advance fire segment?
(jb1's gaming partner ) |
...my idea of a turn is that there are no sequince order-per say. I percieve a turn as you pick a "detachment" to do what they are ordered,be it "charge","advance", or whatever. For instance if you have the iniative and move a detachment with charge orders,they will move to contact with an enemy if this is the case. Now if you have a detachment on first fire and is within range of the detachment that "charged" then you may stop that "charging" detachment and take them under fire. If the "charging" detachment" survives it may then continue to the enemy,make contact and then close assault.
I believe this is the correct procedure. If not please let me know.
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... there is nothing like the smell of bolter burned wraithbone armour in the morning....it smells like...like Victory!
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