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Army Champion feedback
Nerroth
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 3:13 pm 
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Hi!

It seems to me that there is a wide range of experiences/expectations/involvement with forumites between the various Army Champions out there (in this thread I am mainly referring to those ACs responsible for lists still awaiting officialdom, such as Tau, Tyranids, Necrons and Black Legion)

On the one hand, the main problem we at the Tau boards have had (seemingly) has been the lag in feedback - which is understandable, given that Jervis is a busy man! We are more or less able to muck around in the playpen as we see fit, integrating new Studio, SG and FW items when/if appropriate. Our previous Champion, JimmyGrill, was constrained mostly by time commitments (though we look forward to having his input on the list - come back soon Chris!) and while CyberShadow has only been in the hot seat for a short time, it seems that it shouldn't be too much of a problem going from the establishment of a vault-ready updated list to having that list in the Vault - although CS would naturally be in a better position ot coment than I!

On the other hand, we see the problems that Maksim had during his tenure - as well as his issues regarding FW (I find that the opinion held towards Forgeworld varies substantially depending on who you talk to - which can be seen in the aftermath of IA3's release. While the SG pdf for the Qath'fannor was taken down and the future of the list still in dispute, to the extent that the bulk of development on the forum is on our own list for the CPF, while the Epic Tau list in IA3 has pretty much no impact on the future EA Tau force, since they rook an earlier iteration of the list and made their own modifications to it!)

If any of the Champions care to talk about how they have fared in the role, please post your thoughts here - maybe it would help to work out where everyone is coming from, as well as what everyone expects/plans for in the game's development.


Gary




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CyberShadow
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:54 pm 
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I have a somewhat unique perspective in all of this. Since I arrived later than the rest, I ran into the role expecting very little, and so far I have not been disappointed!  ???

My philosophy on all of this is that we (in this case, the EA Tau community) are charged with coming up with a viable list for the game. We can post work in progress and send lists to SG, but in the end it is our job and our job alone. Jervis is there when we have questions, but not always quickly. He may set a deadline, or answer an occassional question.

As for getting a vault list sorted out. All that I can do is document the changes and development, and throw it at SG. I will also host it here.

I think that if we get used to the idea that we are alone in this (whether this is a good or bad thing) then the issue become easier. I think that Maksim had a more difficult time than most as he was restricted on historical issues, such as bringing back the Trygon (which he was instructed that he could not do).

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MaksimSmelchak
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2006 7:56 pm 
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Hi Gary,

No use in crying over spilled milk.

I did my shift and now someone lese will take over.

Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.

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primarch
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Wed Jan 04, 2006 11:39 pm 
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Hi!

Hopefully those who lead the task now will not be dishearted and continue to test and create. :)

Primarch

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Jaldon
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 2:11 am 
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While not a Champion I have been mucking around with EA sense almost day one. In those happy days it almost seemed like the small group then had direct access to JJ.

As time has passed this distance from the group involved with EA and JJ himself has grown to the point that some feel that he is no longer involved.

To be sure any e-mails I have sent to JJ in recent months, concerning another project, have been answered in a week or two (or three, or four), but it's not a problem as it isn't #1 on the GW/SG 'To Do Soon' list.

That is the point, IMHO, the Tau, Nids, Necron, etc, aren't #1 on the EA 'To Do' list yet and it would seem natural that they aren't going to get the lion share of the attention, if any. Chaos Marines, and LatD are the next to be released and I'd be willing to bet that they get far more of JJ's attention.

I am sure that this will be the case when it gets nearer the release date of another list, attention from JJ will increase.

Jaldon :p

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CAL001
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2006 11:32 pm 
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Q. Who is the current AC for marines?

Cheers
CAL
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nealhunt
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 12:21 am 
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Crimson Fury, but he has been MIA since the forum change.

There's a sticky thread with the list of current ACs on the SG boards.

If there are specific changes you would like to see, the ERC members currently are:

Me
Greg Lane
David McLeod (Sotec)
Zac (Blanked on his last name) (Pixelgeek)

I don't think that anything that came up in the last round of proposed changes hasn't been brought up before.  In fact, I would probably guess that the following is a very good approximation of what will be done:

*Armor cost drops 25 points
*Assault bike and Vindicator get speed boost
*TSKNF gets a general upgrade

And there are a few possibles, like the dreadnought formation or adding more access to the Vindicator or Hunter upgrades.

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CAL001
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 2:23 pm 
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Neal

Thanks for the heads up. I thought that was the case and I have been attempting to choose my words wisely. My key concern is that with the lack of an AC, peoples opinion will not be heard. We have seen nothing for twelve months, hence my reason for raising things in the EA Adeptus Astartes area. Can you watch this and use the information to add wait to ERC discussion on Marines. PM me for further discussion or if you want to bounce any ideas with some playtesting.

Thanks again

CAL

Is it possible to get a new AC to guide things for marines again?
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nealhunt
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 3:38 pm 
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Greg and PG have both seen all the discussion on the SG boards.   Sotec, and I have definitely seen all the discussion in both places.  Marine mods had been discussed on the old boards in the dedicated Army Champ/ERC area in addition to all the "public" threads.

There is quite a bit of first-hand experience also.  Greg's play group is practically overrun with SM players - probably 50% or more.  PG had a beautiful SM Salamanders army that he played with a lot before he sold it and focused on CSM and he is currently building/playing a Templars force.  I have a Codex/BA army that I used to play regularly and still play occasionally.

Basically, I feel like everyone is well-informed on the issues and the proposals have been heard repeatedly, even with lack of AC activity.  ERC consensus seems to be the stuff I posted above.

AC:  I don't know anything about the status of CrimsonFury.  I listed him as MIA on the AC list.  It's up to Jervis to decide to appoint someone new if CF hasn't officially resigned.

ERC:  There is an open slot at the moment.  I'm not sure when or if Jervis intends to appoint someone new.  There was a brief discussion among the remaining members as to whether to recommend some candidates, but it never went anywhere.  As the Rules Review is now making slow but steady progress, I don't know if another member is really necessary.

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CAL001
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:40 pm 
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Once again Neal thanks for the heads up. Can you keep the marine board up to date as to where things are going. Do you have a time frame for delivery of ERC changes and implimentation?

Cheers
CAL
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nealhunt
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 11:19 pm 
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Roughly speaking, we want final drafts of all the rules revisions done by the end of February.  Greg is in the driver's seat as he is the Rules Review Champion.  That seems to me like a pretty tight timeline for all of them, but Greg set the timeline and he should know best since he's doing the drafting/editing.

Army revisions should be done in the following 2 months, which I think is a very generous timeline.  I can only think of 2 Ork issues that will require significant discussion, no IG issues, and a couple SM issues.  It should go very quickly.

I am campaigning for a review of the Speed Freeks and White Scars lists at the same time as they have been out quite a while and I think most of the flaws have been ferretted out.

Honestly, I think Swordwind army lists should follow shortly after.  By that time they will have been out a full year.


As far as updating everyone, I think I am probably one of the most forthcoming of the champions/erc members and generally share anything which isn't specifically designated as confidential.  That does occasionally happen (with good reason) but outside of that I do my absolute best to make sure there isn't the appearance of a secret cabal hijacking the development for nefarious purpose. :blues:

===

I am also in favor of a smaller group of champions.  Obviously, you need just one for the core development and I really think that 1-2 for each race is plenty to manage all the variant lists.

While fewer might give contribute to some belief of cabal-like activity, I think it will do a great deal towards focusing development and feedback from the online community.  It would also lessen the number of people Jervis and Andy would need to interact with, which might help keep them a bit more focused.

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 1:54 am 
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No IG stuff? I thought everyone was set on a tweaked Baneblade at least?

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Steve54
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 7:18 pm 
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What about the increase in ranges for the Gatling blaster and turbolasers on the Warlord titans (45cm-60cm)
I can't remember whether they were an errata or a recommended change but they aren't in the errata pdf and certainly need to be officially adopted - I assume most people use them anyway

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wargame_insomniac
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 10:02 pm 
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Quote (The_Real_Chris @ 07 Jan. 2006 (00:54))
No IG stuff? I thought everyone was set on a tweaked Baneblade at least?

That would be nice.

At the moment I would take a Shadowsword or Leman Russes over Baneblade every time.

Cheers

James

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wargame_insomniac
 Post subject: Army Champion feedback
PostPosted: Sat Jan 07, 2006 10:03 pm 
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Neal

Thanks for keeping us all informed- I like the idea of Attack Bike and Vindies getting speed upgrade.

Cheers

James

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