Hi all. I wonder if anyone has any experience of this game. I am looking for a fairly detailed, fantasy warband campaign game. I want something that will let me fight occassionally, and see the warband develop and change as a result.

I looked at Chronopia, but it seems that the rules do not have a campaign section in them.

Confrontation seems good, but it is very difficult to find any information about it. I cant find a decent review anywhere, and even the small reviews are conflicting as some say that the rules are in the blister packs for the minis, while other will sell you the third edition rule book!

So, does anyone have the game? Is it interesting, does it have a lot of potential, an a huge scope for customisation and development and advancement? Are the campaign rules detailed and interesting?

Thanks.

Well - I like the models - but I don't know much aboput it, except that I believe it's French. The producers are Rackham. Nice intro on their site too! It's a skirmish game, and can be played with 5 models per side. It's card+model based - you get cards to go with the models, giving you their capabilities and statistics. Fpr some reason, this had put me off. But the new range of models for 3rd ed has some yummy stuff... anyone see that scarecrow?

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Back from oblivion (again)?

Hi!

The models are wonderful, very detailed very nice, getting somewhat expensive though.

Primarch

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Primarch


The Primarchload
Magnetized Titans Tutorial
Net Epic Gold
Heresy Rules

That is the problem... when the game is mentioned everyone is blown away by the minis. They are fantastic, but I want a something specific from the game system. I may use their minis no matter what game I play.

I have been through the web site, and others, and it seems a really well thought-out system.

From what I can understand, second edition (and first) had the rules included in the mini blisters (and they are reproduced online elsewhere too). It seems that third edition has compiled all of the rules into a single book (rules for magic were added to the basic rules in a seperate blister, and then other suppliments).

But, the book is more than twenty pounds, and it is difficult to find out what is covered and how well it is covered. I may get the third edition rule book anyway.

I've played 3rd edition once. It's a big improvement over the 2nd ed, with the rules all in one place rather than scattered over numerous (irritatingly) tiny booklets and the combat/injury systems receiving some streamlining. Sadly there are no campaign rules, so not sure if it will be right for you, but I'll give you an overview of the game anyway.

Each turn begins with the players sorting their cards, which each represent 1-3 models, in to the order that they desire these models to activate. The players then alternatively reveal the top card in their activation deck, allowing them to move, shoot, charge, cast spells etc with the models that card represents. The player with the least number of cards receives pass counters, allowing him to pass his activation, meaning there is no activation advantage as with epic.

Much of the game (such as shooting and fear) is dealt with by characteristic tests, which involve having to equal or beat a certain difficulty by rolling a D6 and adding the relevant characteristic. Generally, a roll of 1 is an automatic failure while a 6 allows you to roll another D6 and add it to the result, so no test is ever impossible. In the case of shooting, the difficulty is determined by range, cover, whether shooter moved, etc.

Close combat is resolved after the activation phase. The combat system is one of the strong points of the system, with fights proceeding in rounds. Each model is able to make only one attack per round, which gives a nice feel of fighters exchanging blows. There are also numerous decisions to be made in combat, whether to fight aggressively or on the defence, make counter attacks, etc. It's a nice change from the typical GW system of once a fights initiated it's just a matter of rolling the dice.

The rulebook contains all the rules for spells, miracles (effectively priest-type spells), war engines and the myriad special abilities of the various troop types. The translation is notably much better than the old booklets.

On the downside, as mentioned there is no campaign system and the game is very counter heavy, with counters need for keeping track of injuries, who's been charged, magic points, who's immune to what level of fear, etc. IMO the game would also benefit strongly from army books detailing the forces available to each faction.

Thanks Scorba - I'm interested in this too - although as CS pointedout, I'm one of the bown-away-by-the-models camp.
And welcome to Epicomms - and did you know there's a neolithic temple here in Malta with your same name? It's Skorba actually, and is one of the oldest on the island. 3500BC, if I remember correctly.

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Back from oblivion (again)?

I'd recommend Warlord by Reaper. I just purchased the rules and must confess I like them. The rulebook includes campaign rules.

The game is built upon RAGE (Reaper Adventure Game Engine), which is used in CAV, too.

The game is action based. Barring special rules, every model may make a single non-combat action and a single combat action. A combat action, however, may include more than one attack if the model has multiple atacks.

The troops are activated by making an activation deck (from basic playing cards, for example) with one card per formation and possible bonus cards from officers with special abilities.

The command system is simple and often seen: troops need to stay within command distance of their leader. If they are out of command, there are no immediate penalties. However, if they are forced to make a discipline check they fail easier than when an officer is leading them and may even retreat (i.e. rout).

Large models and heroes have a damage track, like the mechs in CAV. IMO this is one of the better inventions in RAGE. When the hero or monster is wounded, his abilities (like attack values and discipline) decrease representing him succumbing to his wounds.

There are 10 factions in the game and an armylist for each is included in the rule book. Separate army books are in the pipeline with only the Necropolis book being ready at the moment.

The fluff and art are, IMO, very good. In fact, it rates in my book among that of Warmachine and Chronopia.

Here's a link to the .pdf which has a short summary of the game system (NOT rules) and the fluff:
http://www.reapermini.com/pdf/warlordsneakpeekweb.pdf

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I don't know and I let who care. -J.S.

I have about 10 Wolfen, about half painted for Confrontation, and they are really nice figures. I havent found them too difficult to paint either, although it helps that you dont need many to play.

I havent actually managed to get anyone to play it yet  But that may change soon  The ones I bought had the rule books in the blisters, yes, and to be honest if the current ones are still packed that way go for it. That way you can try the rules (I dont think there is a HUGE difference between 2nd and 3rd ed), but it doesnt cost you anything if you want to play something else (like Warlord Although anything by Reaper is a pain in the arse to get in the UK ).

I do have a VERY vague memory of their being a 'gaining experience' booklet in one pack I bought (there were several booklets covering relevant rules for the model they came with), but I could be wrong...I will have a look tonight.

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Reaversbane (or RB for short...)

D'oh! Of course... Warlord. I really should have remembered that considering a) I currently have a few Reaper Warlord minis for my mass battle game (Battlestorm) and b) I am half way through reading CAV right now.

I think that I will pick up Warlord as soon as I can, as the 'graceful degradation' with wounds seems like a great idea... and it comes with campaign rules. (Why, why, why do people make skirmish rules sets without the campaign/warband development rules already included? I just dont see the reasoning.)

I found a review of Confrontation 3 on the TMP boards. It seems that third edition includes the two booklets for the divination and magic, but the third available booklet from the second edition (Incarnation) is due as a seperate suppliment. Also, there was the view that it would be more RPG format.

This is a real shame. I think that I will get Warlord, use whatever minis I can for the rank and file and get Confrontation minis for the characters.

Thanks all.

Holy snikeys!

I must have that flute player when it is released.  I believe it is a moral imperative.

Regarding using Confrontation minis - had I not found a supercheap army of GW beastman minis, I would have built an all-minotaur WFB army using the Wolfen or Devourers minis.

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Neal

If our tastes are at all alike I'm sure you'll enjoy it.  

But what ees thees Battlestorm? Is it something commercial or your own rules?

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I don't know and I let who care. -J.S.

Quote (Mojarn Piett @ Sep. 30 2005,14:35)

But what ees thees Battlestorm? Is it something commercial or your own rules?

Now you have got me started...

Battlestorm is an interesting rule set, which was released a fair while ago and which is now deader than Epic! YOu cant buy the rule book new, only second hand. It has a few interesting twists for a fantasy wargame:

- Formation. You can change your formation structure (are you listening GW) to column, open order, close order, etc.

- Initiative. Each formation activates in a similar way to Epic, but when a formation comes within a certain range of the enemy, or performs a certain action, it halts and the enemy formation activates to interupt it. (This can, in turn, activate other enemies, etc... leading to a battlestorm!)

- Striking initiative in close combat is done by the weapon length. Pikes strike before swords, which strike before daggers, etc.

Overall, it is a very interesting game with a few problems:

- It uses D30. Enough said!

- It started to edge more towards roleplay and got bogged down in the detail of wounds, etc. I guess that it would work for what I am looking for, but I got hold of it on its merits as a larger scale game.

There is an ongoing (and by that, I mean that it has taken years to go nowhere) resurrection project, but that is also heading more to RPG lands.

Quote (CyberShadow @ Sep. 30 2005,15:19)

- It uses D30. Enough said!

GW's obesssion with D6 drives me nuts! I just don't understand why they don't design games that use something besides D6.

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"I don't believe in destiny or the guiding hand of fate." N. Peart

Oh, I agree totally. I dont understand the obsession either. A D6 just does not have the potential in more recent games development. Personally, I favour the D12 - more than this and it becomes a bit more difficult to read quickly (a D30 is almost a ping pong ball!), less and there is no variation.

Even GW is starting to push the limitations of the D6. When I started 40K, Marines saved on a 4+, Terminators on a 2+. Then, Marines went down to a 3+, and then a 2+, while Terminators started to roll two dice and saving if either was a 2+ (or something like that).

And still, Jervis and co. estoll the virtue of the D6, even to the point that they state that you should really one use half of the results, effectively using a D3.

Anyway, I managed to find probably the only supplier in the UK that stocks Warlord, and order myself a copy. It should be with me at the beginning of next week. I am still not entirely sure that Warlord will meet my needs - I am not sure if the campaign rules are map based army stuff, or warband development stuff. I am looking for warband development, not map-based armies. I started thinking about sci fi warbands, and I have dug out Rogue Trader to look at the warband rules there.

I haven't read the campaign rules, but I skimmed them through and can give a (very) short summary.

To put it short, I think the rules are about both things you mentioned. The campaign system is map based but there are also rules for unit development.

Since the campaign is map based, each map area gives certain amount of resources, which can be used to buy equipment, hire mercenaries  etc.

One neat feature is that you can loot special equipment from your opponent and use it yourself.  

Troops and characters can develop by gaining experience. If the troops suffer casualties, they can also lose experience.

EDIT: If you want to try a fantasy mass-combat game with a  different (and I do mean different) feel I'd recommend Maelstorme by Alternative Armies. There are formation changes and the command system is something different from anything I have seen.

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I don't know and I let who care. -J.S.