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[Solved] Special Ability Waystone Spirit: Living Eldar ?

 Post subject: [Solved] Special Ability Waystone Spirit: Living Eldar ?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2016 2:14 pm 
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Hi,

a question about the Waystone Spirit rule and more precisely the terms: "Living Eldar"

In this special ability description, if a Warlock is not within 10cm of the unit, it will duplicate the order of a Living Eldar within 10cm or charge toward the closest Living Eldar.

My question is what is called a Living Eldar ?

I assume a Living Eldar is NOT a wraithguard/wraithlord/avatar but is a Phantom titan, a Fireprism or a Falcon a valid "Living Eldar" ?

On my side, I understand that a Living Eldar unit is an infantry stand or a light artillery or jetbike but there are also some Living Eldars inside a fireprism or tempests...

I suppose the Living Eldar definition could depend on player group but any clarification is welcome ;)


Last edited by scream on Sun Oct 09, 2016 1:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: [Special Ability] Waystone Spirit: Living Eldar ?
PostPosted: Wed Oct 05, 2016 3:15 pm 
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Just for reference I will paste in my argument into this thread also:

I took the definition from the rulebook (they define units as shown below, where organic is the default):

Image

Organic units are all units not robotic or inorganic, as defined in the rulebook. A lot of the psysic powers will not affect inorganic units, but will by default affect anything not inorganic. Such powers will affect falcons and this also shows that e.g. falcons are organic and therefore living? (impossible to be organic and not living)

Therefore falcons, fireprism etc. are organic according to the definition of the rules as written?

As I see it there are 4 categories and each unit is one of the 4 (angelic does not exsist, so rather 3) and organic units are the living units otherwise I see no reason to define the categories in the rules if they are not used for defining living units.

Thats just my understanding of the rules, but I can see where the confusion about living eldar comes from. IMO it should say organic eldar to follow the wording put forth in the core rulebook. No need to have different definitions in each book, but use the "central" definition of units.

P.S. I fully argree that the avatar, wraith constructs etc. are not "living" eldar units.


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 Post subject: Re: [Special Ability] Waystone Spirit: Living Eldar ?
PostPosted: Thu Oct 06, 2016 6:16 pm 
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My understanding of the "Living" or "Organic" requirements are referring to what controls the actions of the model in question. That is, does it have a living, organic brain or not? Thus a Falcon, Fireprism, or any other Eldar vehicle that is crewed by living Eldar counts as "Living". A Phantom Titan should count, as they do generally have living crew alongside the Soulstones. Wraithguard, Wraithlord, etc would not count. I'm not sure one way or the other about the Avatar, but probably not.

In other words, as stated above, any model not specifically called out as "Robotic" or "Inorganic" would qualify as "Living" for most if not all purposes. Note however, that some Inorganic models (notably Necrons) are both Inorganic and Living at the same time. Kinda anyway.

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 Post subject: Re: [Special Ability] Waystone Spirit: Living Eldar ?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 4:00 am 
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Hi!

I can see the reason for the confusion. As usual a lot of the original wording net epic used when it was rewritten may not be the most clear.

The intent, given the elder background of the time, was that any elder unit that was still "living" aka, had not died and his soul transferred to a waystone was "alive". If the unit needed to be powered by a waystone to "act" then it was ineligible.

Thus dreadnaughts, wraithguard, etc would not count. Infantry and vehicles crewed by eldar units would count.

The Avatar is tricky. He is technically a god. More akin to a demon than eldar infantry. I would render him ineligible since his primal emotion render any "command" functions impossible.

Titans are actually also tricky, since some eldar titans use waystones too. To keep it simple I would allow them as an eligible unit.

Robotic or inorganic designated units are most likely ineligible. Since only eldar units should be able to influence such units odd forces like Necron are moot.

My two cents.

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 Post subject: Re: [Special Ability] Waystone Spirit: Living Eldar ?
PostPosted: Sun Oct 09, 2016 1:25 pm 
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Thanks all for your replies :)

We'll follow your replies and we'll consider as Living Eldar anything but WraithGuard, WraithLord and Avatar :)


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