from those options I'd probably pick #2 as #3 sounds way too harsh....

while it's thematic and fluffy, I dislike the water grotz idea as it's inventing a special rule to partially counter a different special rule which seems inelegant to me.....

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Bit confused about #3, if it's just a fire then surely it is 0+ damage? If so I would go for that, it gets harsh if you use it for all 3 moves in a march, which is exactly how it should be. But even then you're going to average 2DC damage which is a calculated risk.

Or do you mean a point of damage and a fire?

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3 fires will likely do more than 2DC over the course of the game as they keep burning after doing the damage.... I think option 3 has the chance to get out of control quite quickly....

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True, I guess it depends on what you want to achieve with the rule. For me it should be an ability you use occasionally for a crucual engagement or so - like once per game - to stop the list feeling like "gargants but fast". If the effect is that you never use it 3x in a march that is absolutely fine with me.

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if that is the case, then something else needs to be done with the list to make it competetive IMO, if the ability is basically so dangerous you only use it when desperate, you're effectively back to square one... the list can't shoot well thanks to a combination of weak-ish ranged weapons and needing to double to reliably activate, it can't engage effectively with its 15cm range and comparative lack of powerful FF options and it's too slow to contest objectives effectively.... so how does the list move forward to address these issues?

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on option 2, what happens with the boiler/water grot?

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Np upgrade then because then you only run a 50% chance of getting hurt from doing 1,2 o 3 moves. Thats to weak i think.

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Only fires, no damage.

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before deciding how harsh the push 'em should be id like to know what other areas are going to be considered for change in the list, in terms of overall balance?

I'd be ok with 3, but only if weapons were tweaked, for example. Otherwise, probably option 2.

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AFK with real life, still checking PMs

Well, the only thing thats going to change for the nexr version except this rule is tje Wyrdboy rower upgrade which will become a flakka dakka upgrade.

Then some more battle reports. The last 2 games i had was pretty solid wins so I'm not entirly sure we need that much more tweaking. But that opinion can change after a couple of more games...

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I'll try and get a few more games in, my concern is against highly mobile armies (marines, eldar) the list struggles to respond, if it comes up against an army which tends to get stuck in with big formations (black legion, orks, guard) then it's much better off, my big losses have been against eldar and marines who can hide and plink, pick off the smaller stuff like lootas and soopa stompas and win through activation advantage

I'd be keen to see/try some batreps against AMTL to see how the list fares against an army which can take it on one-for-one in both shooting and engagements

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Why no Blast Marker though? It will surely cause a commotion on the Garg if its boilers start burning. Plus its a neat way to make an Engagement (when the extra move comes most in handy) that more dangerous. Would also vote for "Reinforced Boilers" are gone after failing test once.

If failed: 1 BM, 1DC damage and 1 Fire if failed; Special Rule is lost (so you can get this result only once)

How about that? Perhaps increase to 1D3 dmg

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That seems quite extreme. Also its Ork Tech, those grots shouldn't be that surprised when something or other explodes/starts a fire, they are likely use to it.

I like option two, I agree with Apoc's assessment (if the list stays the same, make the +5cm move draw back not so harsh to compensate). I've played a few games against very mobile Marine and Eldar lists already and that was using the original boilers (+5cm move no draw back) and still had quite a tough time. The cheaper Supa-Stompas with the +2 to mob up will certainly help. The Supa's were so garbagy before, break once and would never rally.

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Hello supporters and haters!

Now when the EEC is done I've turned my attention back to the Gargant list! Version 3.3.1 has just been released. The following changes where done to the list:

- "Push em arder ladz" rule changed to 1 auto fire per activation using the rule.
- Wyrdboy tower upgrade replaced by Flakka Dakka upgrade.
- Reinforced boiler upgrade dropped.

I feel we're getting close to the final version now, this might even be it. Please let me know of any concerns (but please do it in an adult and constructive way) with the list. You can find the list in the OP. I would like to merge all the documents into one but don't have the technical know-how. Any help with that would be appreciated!

The aim is to get this list approved before 2016 is over.

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GROUP 1, Battlereport 1/6: viewtopic.php?f=84&t=31350&p=592863#p592863

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