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(BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

CAL001

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 4:10 pm

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Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:54 am
Posts: 1927
Location: Australia

High all

This week has seen the start of a series of trial games looking at a revised Marine list based on an Armoured Heavy Marine Army. I have looked at making changes to the existing list rather than creating a new one.

We are using all the current known changes for SM Rules and Stats with the following additions:

1. Marine Armour - Add One or Two of the following at 75 points each (Predator & Vindicator), add Two Land Raiders at 175 points. (Where LR Tpt has been taken as an option Marine Armour LR are not available)

* This upgrade is available to Tac, Dev and Armour Formations. The costing for this have been taken from the Scions of Iron list already up on the boards.

2. Land Raider Transport - Replace all Rhinos in a formation with Land Raiders at 85 points each.

*Once again available to Tac and Dev. I know Devs can already get them I am testing costing and the viability of LR in Tac formations.

3. Vindicators as an upgrade for Devs

* Something I think they should have had from the begining.

4. Land Raider Helios upgrade for LR Formations at 25 points per upgrade.

*I know so cheap, but the stats that I use the LR looses it Tpt capacity and the HB in trade.

5. Hunters availabl to Tac, Dev and armour formations.

So to the Batrep.

Marine List

1. Tactical Det 1 = 675
6 x Tac Marines
1 x Sup Comd
2 x Rhino
2 x Razorback HB
2 x Predators Annihilators
1 x Hunter

2. Tac Det 2 = 625 Nice pickup Soren
6 x Tac Marines
1 x Librarian
2 x Rhino
2 x Razorback LC
2 x Predator Destructor
1 x Hunter

3. Land Raider Det 1 = 600
4 x Land Raider
2 x Land Raider Helios

4. Land Raider Det 2 = 550
4 x Land Raiders
2 x Land Raiders

5. Whirlwind Det 1 = 375
4 x Whirlwinds
1 x Hunter

6. Whirlwind Det 2 = 375
4 x Whirlwinds
1 x Hunter

7. Bike Det 1 = 250
5 x Bike Units
1 x Chaplain

8. Bike Det 2 = 250
5 x Bike Units
1 x Chaplain

9. Thunderbolt Det 1 = 150
2 x Thunderbolt Fighters

10. Thunderbolt Det 2
2 x Thunderbolt Fighters

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CAL001

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 4:16 pm

Brood Brother

Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:54 am
Posts: 1927
Location: Australia

So the Setup

From the bottom of the picture to the top, we have

LR Det 1
Tac Det 1
Bike Det 1
Whirl Det 1
LR Det 2
Whirl Det 2
Bike Det 2
Tac Det 2

As to OBJ in my half, my Blitz is behind Tac Det 1, the two black disk are Geoff's OBJ

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Soren

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 4:19 pm

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Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 9:42 am
Posts: 694
Location: Austria

1. Tactical Det 1 = 675
6 x Tac Marines
1 x Sup Comd
2 x Rhino
2 x Razorback HB
2 x Predators Annihilators
1 x Hunter

2. Tac Det 2 = 575
6 x Tac Marines
1 x Librarian
2 x Rhino
2 x Razorback LC
2 x Predator Destructor
1 x Hunter

Between Tactical 1 and Tactical 2 the point difference should only be 50pts not 100. As SC is an upgrade worth 100 and librarian is worth 50. Else the detachments are the same.

Soren

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CAL001

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 4:22 pm

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Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:54 am
Posts: 1927
Location: Australia

The Guard Mechanized Infantry Hoard

1. Guard Mech Regt HQ
+ Heavy Weapons
+ Hydra

2. Guard Mech Coy 1
+ Orgrins
+ Hydra

3. Guard Mech Coy 2
+ Snipers
+ Hydra

4. Guard Arty Coy - all Basilsik
+ Hydra

5. Bombard Battery

6. Super heavy Tank Coy
3 x Baneblades

7. Thunderbolt Det

8. Marauder Det

9. Marauder Det

* We also trialed some changes to the Maruader as discussed here. We used DC2 and reduced the save to 5+. and the propoed changes to Baneblades.

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CAL001

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 4:29 pm

Brood Brother

Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:54 am
Posts: 1927
Location: Australia

Guard Setup

From the bottom of the picture, we have

Guard Mech Coy 2
Guard Arty Coy
Guard Super Hvy Tk Coy
Guard Regt Hq
Bombard Bty
Guard Mech Coy 1

Objectives, the black disk is Geoff's Blitz, the Marine OBJ's are the top right building and one two buildings in front of Guard Mech Coy 2.

More tomorrow, its 1.30am here in Oz and I am off to bed.

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Evil and Chaos

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 5:36 pm

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Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire

(Hena @ Jun. 29 2007,16:54)

QUOTE

Might I ask why not use Scions list?

There are several things in it to balance the armour changes. And one of them is to prevent too large formation as those tacticals (and not take the speciality of BA away).

Frankly, after the latest White Dwarf list, the BA list doesn't even represent them properly anymore.

I'm all for allowing tanks to be attached to infantry formations in the core list... I think it's one way of making them viable without needing a seperate armylist.

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The_Real_Chris

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:23 pm

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Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm
Posts: 8139
Location: London

Have you seen the 'ground based' marine list I've been trying to put together (Imperial Fists for sake of a theme). Whether or not you agree with the list the findings to date are pretty interesting - one being the the armour upgrades to formations are rarely worth their weight in razorbacks - it comes down to 1 tank and two rhino or 3 razors and a rhino.

Thread here though I managed to get a game today (friday weekend in BD and I'm down chitagon) trying them out again and want to make a few more changes before general playtesting begins.

Oh and last batrep here.

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Evil and Chaos

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:40 pm

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Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire

Sorry, we're going really OT here.

(Marine) armour ... are rarely worth their weight in razorbacks

Fixed it for 'ya TRC.

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The_Real_Chris

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 6:48 pm

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Joined: Mon Jul 04, 2005 4:45 pm
Posts: 8139
Location: London

Oh, where?

65 point upgrades?

Back on topic interesting guard list I would use 2 manticores and 1 hydra battery or vultures, arty and Hydra and so on. More activations, similar firepower. Can't wait to see how it does!

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BlackLegion

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 7:38 pm

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Joined: Sat Nov 05, 2005 12:13 am
Posts: 8711
Location: Leipzig, Germany, Europe, Sol III, Orion Arm, Milky Way, Local Group, Virgo Supercluster, Universe

(Evil and Chaos @ Jun. 29 2007,18:36)

QUOTE

Frankly, after the latest White Dwarf list, the BA list doesn't even represent them properly anymore.

Care to explain in a separate thread?

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CAL001

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Fri Jun 29, 2007 11:44 pm

Brood Brother

Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:54 am
Posts: 1927
Location: Australia

Right, down to business. It's not a Blood Angels list, I use Blood Ravens. On to the game.

Turn 1

Initiative = Marine

M - Bike to on the right flank doubles forward and takes up a position behind the right hand hill out of the way of the prying eyes of Mech Coy 1.

IG - Guard Thunderbolts take up a holding pattern high above the battlefield on CAP.

M - Marine Thunderbolt 1 Takes a similar stance ready to pounce on any unsuspecting Marauders.

IG - Guard Mech Coy 1 fails to receive transmissions over the vox and stands still removing the solitary BM.

M - Tac 2 Advances into the valley left of bike to in anticipation of a general advance against Marine OBJ 2.

IG - Arty Coy Sustains Fire against Whirwind 2, killing one Whirlwind and placing 3 BM.

M - Thunderbolt 2 goes on CAP and assumes a position a thousand feet below Thunderbolt 1.

IG - The Bombard Battery sensing a lack of range Advance forward into the ruined city hoping to unleash hell on turn 2.

M - Bike Det 1 makes a double and take up a position in the low ground behind the left hand hill.

IG - Mech Coy 2 Doubles forward and takes Marine OBJ 1, debussing Guardsmen throughout the ruined buildings.

M - Whirlwind 1 Sustains Fire against Mech Coy 2 killing a single Guardsmen.

IG - Marauder 1 makes a Ground Attack against Tac 2. Defensive flak causes no kills, Thunderbolt 1 Intercepts and is fire at causing two hits, they jink and one gets away. The Marauders drop their bombs and kill both of Tac 2's Predators.

* Question, we played the air as follows, Approach Move - Defensive Flak - Intercept Move - Defensive Fire From Marauder - Interceptor Fire. Is this right?

M - Land Raider 1 Doubles forward to support Bike one, unleashing a volley against Mech Coy 2 it kills a single Chimera.

IG - Super Hvy Tk Doubles towards Marine OBJ 1, firing on Land Raider 1 causing no damage.

M - Whirlwind 2 Marshalls removing all of its BM.

IG - Guard Regt Hq sensing what the Marines are up to on the left Doubles forward and debuses on Marine OBJ 2.

M - Land Raider 2 seeing the Guard Commanders penant doubles forward and fires on his formation killing two Chinera.

IG - Marauder 2 Fails to scramble due to Gin and Ton Ton hour at the officers club at the airbase. Maybe later they will turn up.

M - Tac 1 makes a Double and takes up a postion right of Land Raider 1 in front of Marine OBJ 1. They fire on Mech Coy, 2 killing another Chimera.

Rally
Air
IG - Gain a further BM on Marauder 1
M - No change

Ground
IG - Mech Coy 2 Fails, with wobbling legs at the sight of so much Marine Armour arrayed in front of it.
M - Coms are good, everybody rallies

Bike 1 and Mech 2

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CAL001

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:17 am

Brood Brother

Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:54 am
Posts: 1927
Location: Australia

Turn 2

Initiative = Marine

M - Good coms from Bike Det 2 identifies the Guard Regt Hq with nine stands in a single building, Whirlwind 2 Sustains Fire Killing four Guardsmen.

M - Land Raider 2 Advances, Firing into the flank of the Super Hvy Tk Coy causing three hits and no damage. If there is one thing Geoff does well, its save those dam Super Heavys of his. This was a mistake on my part I should have pressed the advantage and sustained fire on the Guard Regt Hq.

IG - The Bombards finding targets in range, Sustain Fire on Tac 1 causing two hits with no kills.

IG - The Baneblades sensing they where about to get caught in a hail of lascannon fire advance and fire on Tac 1. The hails of lead and las fire kills, a Razorback, 2 Rhinos and four Tac stands. I cannot for the life of me save Marines.

M - Seeing the damage raught on their commanders formation, Land Raider 1 Advances and Fires on the Baneblades, seven hits and not a single damage point.

IG - Marauder 2, putting down their gin and tonics, decides its time to get in on the act and Ground Attacks Land Raider 2. Thunderbolt 2 dives on them from above causing one hit but loosing a Thunderbolt in reply.

* This time we played the air combat out simultaniously?

Combat on the Left Flank

IG - Guard Thunderbolts, realising they may have similar if not equal skills to the Marines Chapter Serfs, intercept Thunderbolt 2, defensive fire from a Hunter kills one. The other manages to shoot down Thunderbolt 2 remaining aircraft as it duels with the bombers.

M - Tac 1 Marshalls and takes up a position in the ruins in front of, and out of sight of the Baneblades. Removing 3 of its many BM.

IG - Mech Coy 2 finding its Vox Operator dead from a stray lascannon shot Marshall removing 6 BM.

M - Thunderbolt 1 goes back up to 10,000 feet and resumes CAP duties.

IG - Marauder 1 Ground Attacks Land Raider 2, Thunderbolt 1 rolls in taking out a Marauder, but is struck by the second and crashes into the ground. The remaining Marauder dumps its payload killing nothing.

M - Tac 2 Advances and fires on Guard Regt Hq, killing a single Chimera.

IG - Arty Coy Sustains Fire on Tac 1, destroying a Razorback and breaking the formation. It withdraws behiund the Land Raiders, taking up a position of overwatch on the lfet hand hill.

IG - Regt HQ has trouble receiving Vox from Theatre Command. The Operator is summarily executed by the Commisar and 8 BM are removed.

M - Bike 2 Advances left of Tac 2 and takes up a position ready to assault on turn 3.

IG - Mech Coy 1 Marches and takes up a position behind the central buildings poised to move left or right as need be.

M - Bike 1 Advances over the hill in preperation for an assault on Mech Coy 2.

Rally
Air
IG - Marauder 2 takes a further hit on the route out.
M - All gone

Ground
IG - Mech 2 and Sup Hvy Tk Fail
M - all good

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CAL001

Post subject: (BATREP) Marine Armour Concept

Posted: Sat Jun 30, 2007 12:43 am

Brood Brother

Joined: Sat Nov 26, 2005 12:54 am
Posts: 1927
Location: Australia

Turn 3

Initiative = Draw (Guard)

IG - Baneblades Engage Land Raider 1. The Raiders reposition to maximize their fire power. Hails of fire unleash from both sides, two Baneblades explode into fireballs and all Raiders stand defiant of the lowly Guardsmen. The remaining Baneblande, with its Commisar, stand defiant.

M - Land Raider 1 turns and Sustains Fire on Mech Coy 2, the resulting fire kills 2 Guard stands and four vehicles.

M - Bike 1 seeing the Guard numbers dwindling, Engages Mech Coy 2 defeating them in a firefight. Three bikes are gone, but four guardsmen are dead and they are in headlong retreat towards their own line. Marine OBJ 1 is secure.

The Assault

IG - Mech Coy 1 Engages Land Raider 2. 21 stands to 5, 11 scoring hits to 1. 1 Orgrin dies and 4 Landraiders are incinerated by the hail of fire from the massed Guard formation. Broken the remaining Raider withdraws behind Bike 2.

IG - Arty Coy Sustains Fire on Tac 2, one Razorback and one marine are killed by the barrage. The sting has been taken out of the Marines right flank.

M - Whirlwind 1 Sustains Fire on the remounted Guard Mech Coy 1, destroying a single Chimera and one stand of Guardsmen.

IG - After the loss of a comrade on the last sortie, Marauder 2 returns to the Officers Club for another drink and fails to hear the callout for another mission.

M - Whirlwind 2 Sustains fire on the same Guardsmen filled building on Marine OBJ 2, killing two more members of the Regt Hq.

IG - Not detured by the weight of fire that they have received, Guard Regt Hq Advances and fires on Tac 2. Three more marines are killed breaking the formation. They withdraw to the cover of the mountain and consolidate.

M - Tac 1 Sustains fire on the Broken Baneblade causing no damage. Dam fearless Commisar.

IG - Bombards Advance up to Marine OBJ 2.

M - Bike 2 sensing that the right is about to fall, move to and secure Guard OBJ 1.

IG - Marauder 1, hearing the call that Marauder 2 missed, Ground Attack Land Raider 1 causing no damage.

Rally
Air
IG - Ok

Ground
IG - Regt Hq and Mech 2 fail
M - all good

Victory = 0-0 Turn 4 here we come.

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