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Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700

 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:38 am 
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Here's another - I don't have as clear a recollection as to exactly what went on, but I'll try to piece it together.

My Eldar had the same list as last time, bumped up to 2700.
Avatar, two Guardians, both with HWPs and one with a Council and SWPs.  2 Fire Prism troupes, 2 Night Spinners, 1 Falcon w/ Firestorms, 2 Revenants, and a Swooping Hawk Troupe.

He had-
Regimental HQ w/ 9 Griffons - 800
3 Shadowswords w/ 3 Russes - 700
2x 3 Hydras - 300
3x Warhound - 750
2 Thunderbolts - 150

Deployment was very spread out - Seer Council and some Prisms on the far left behind a hill, Night Spinners in the middle (there was a nice big forest for them to hide in), and everything else over on the right, behind another forest to their left and a hill midway up the board and touching the right board edge.  All 3 Warhounds set up opposite the Revenants, as did some Hydras.  The HQ took up the entire middle section of his deployment zone, and the Shadowswords and another Hydra group took the left bit.

Ulthwe won the strategy roll, and decided to commence pop-up attacks.  Prisms fired on the left Hydra group and on the closest Warhound, doing no damage whatsoever to the Hydras and taking a Void Shield off the Hound.  The implacable advance of Warhounds then begun, with two of them cresting the hill to lay down fire on the Revenants.  One Revenant took a hit.  The Falcons responded by sustaining on the nearest Hound, inflicting a total of 14 AT hits and wiping it off the board.  Not wanting to touch the Revenants until all of the Warhounds had used up their double-moves, I let the Guard go.  The next Warhound came up and shot at the Prisms, failing to do damage.  The right Hydra group doubled forwards, losing a member to dangerous terrain.  The single unsuppressed Hydra shot with its AT6 gun, and managed to critical hit one of the Revenants.  The left Hydra group then doubled forwards and put a BM on the Prisms on that side of the board.  The Guardians over there responded by frying a Hydra and breaking that group - it fell back to where it started.  The Thunderbolts fly in, kill one of the left Prisms, and fly off, the broken Prisms flee to hide behind the forest in the middle where my Night Spinners are, leaving the Guardians to fend for themselves.  The Shadowswords see their opportunity, advancing and killing four of the left Guardians (LoS to the mess o' things on the right was blocked by a forest).  The Night Spinners on the right shoot at a Warhound and at the 2 Hydras, breaking the already BM-ed Hydra group and taking out a Void Shield.  The Hydras run back to where they started.  The Guardians on the right retain and shoot the same Warhound, hoping to knock off the last Shield, but fail.  The massive HQ group then marches forwards, stopping with all of its Griffons within 24" of everything on the right, but still largely hidden by the forests.  Unfortunately for them, they're within 1' of the Farseer.  The middle Spinners try to shoot at them, fail initiative, and so only manage to cause a single blast marker for coming under fire.  The Revenants decide not to go after the Hounds (who've used up their plasma already) and instead jump over to be closer to the Guardians, killing a Guardsman in the process.  Virtually everything regroups - the Revenants still have a BM, and a great deal of Guard stuff is down to a single BM.

The Avatar appears halfway between the Guardians and the HQ group, and the Hawks teleport in next to him, taking a BM in the process.  Ulthwe wins the strategy roll.  The Spinners in the middle shoot at the HQ group, bringing them to 3 BMs.  The Avatar then calls a combined assault - Guardians, Hawks, Revenants, and the Avatar himself charge in, cutting down 8 units and losing two Hawks and a Guardian.  The Eldar overwhelmingly win the assault, killing 7 more units, and the defeated HQ section flees behind the rightward hill.  Everything except the Avatar then consolidates back behind the forest.  Falcons sustain on one of the Warhounds, suppressing it.  Said Warhound decides to assault the Prisms, inflicting a kill.  The other Warhound lays into the Revenants, bringing the Holofielded one down to 1 DC.  The Guardians on the left hide back behind their hill.  The Shadowswords, having no better targets, unload on the Avatar, causing a critical hit and thus breaking the Fire Prisms behind the middle forest.  The single unsuppressed Prism on the right sustains into a Warhound, destroying it.  The Thunderbolts take pot shots at the Guardians on the left, killing one.  The Night Spinners on the right unload on the 9 surviving members of the HQ selection, killing 4 and causing 5 BMs which wipe the unit out and give the Eldar the BTS goal.  Guard fail a whole lot of rally rolls without the SC, and Eldar cleans most units, excepting Prisms in the middle, who remain broken.

Guard win the strategy roll and promptly sustain on the Revenants with the last Warhound.  The Revenants roll over and die.  Shadowswords attempt an action, fail, and decide to just move a little bit up the board (putting them onto the Eldar half).  Rightward Prisms move out over the forest, shoot at the Swords and pick off the Russ claiming an objective on the Guard side, before hiding behind the middle forest and joining up with their broken friends.  Thunderbolts screw with the Guardians again.  Middle Spinners unload on the Shadowswords, doing nothing.  Leftward Hydra group marches forwards, claims left objective on the Eldar side.  Falcons sustain into Warhound, doing damage.  Last Hydra group marches over to the left to join up with the Swords and other Hydras.  Blitzing forward, the Hawks take the objective recently vacated by the Lanced Russ, the Guardians march up to take a nearby objective on the Guard side, and the game ends with Eldar having 2 objectives on the Guard side and having killed the HQ, for a total of 2 points, and the Guard having killed the Revenants for a total of 1 point.  Game - Ulthwe, 2-1.

This seemed a very close game.  Guard was winning right up until the Hawks and Guardians marched forward.  The Revenants did a whole lot of nothing, though that was mostly due to me being overcautious.  The assault was amazing, and was the first real example of its kind that we've seen.  We're suddenly looking at things like Warp Spiders and Hellhounds in a new light.

More analysis to follow, but it's late and I should really be getting to bed.


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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 10:52 am 
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I'm pretty sure it's 1 company upgrade of type per company. So no 9 griffons possible I'm affraid :D.

Wish you could. I would be fielding some 30 strong IG companies then :laugh: .

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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 11:45 am 
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Quote (tneva82 @ 09 Mar. 2006 (09:52))
I'm pretty sure it's 1 company upgrade of type per company. So no 9 griffons possible I'm affraid :D.

That's right. Page 134 of the rulebook:

In addition, companies may be given up to three company
upgrades. Each type of upgrade can only be taken once by a
company (ie, an infantry company could have an Ogryn and
a Sniper upgrade, but not two Sniper upgrades). Upgrades
are added to the company and are not a separate formation.
Support formations may not be given company upgrades.


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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:02 pm 
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The Eldar list seems a lot more balanced than then IG one. The IG army looks like it relys on too many WEs.

Cheers for the BatRep Gotchaye!


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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 12:04 pm 
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Quote (asaura @ 09 Mar. 2006 (10:45))
That's right. Page 134 of the rulebook:

In addition, companies may be given up to three company
upgrades. Each type of upgrade can only be taken once by a
company (ie, an infantry company could have an Ogryn and
a Sniper upgrade, but not two Sniper upgrades). Upgrades
are added to the company and are not a separate formation.
Support formations may not be given company upgrades.

Eep!

Does this apply to the Baran Siegemaster list too? If so I may have made a little mistake with my army list in the last battle I had... :D


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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 2:10 pm 
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Couple of questions/comments:

Quote (Gotchaye @ 09 Mar. 2006 (09:38))
?The Avatar then calls a combined assault - Guardians, Hawks, Revenants, and the Avatar himself charge in, cutting down 8 units and losing two Hawks and a Guardian.


Looks like the Avatar brought more friends with him than he was supposed to. ?In a combined assault, a commander can bring up to three formations with him including his own. ?The Avatar counts as one of those "three", so only two additional formations can be brought along.

Falcons sustain on one of the Warhounds, suppressing it. ?Said Warhound decides to assault the Prisms, inflicting a kill.


When you say the Warhound was "suppressed", do you mean it had 3 blast markers? ?If so it's broken, even though fearless, and is unable to take any actions.

Good report.

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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 3:30 pm 
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Ah...... didn't spot that in the siege batrep, sorry!

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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 6:43 pm 
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Just an observation,

Both lists are very vehicle heavy.

The IG list seems very suspectable to close combat and MW/TK attacks.

The Eldar list appears to have limited infantry and relies on the vehicles to do the damage. This is a more common list that I've seen as compared to the former. However, this list still does seem a bit fragile to an AT heavy force.

Questions to the Eldar player,

Why no vampire?

How do you feel about the prisms overall?

Are 2 formations of prisms your norm?

Are swooping hawks a staple for you?

Cheers,

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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Thu Mar 09, 2006 8:44 pm 
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Oh wow, that was a lot of cheating.  We completely overlooked that page before the Guard list, and I stopped reading 'commander' when I saw '3 formations with him'.  No real excuse for allowing Fearless Warhounds to go around suppressed and unbroken, though.  Fortunately, little of it mattered, as the Guard squad never fired its Griffons, the Guardians would have been just fine lending supporting fire after sustaining, and the Warhound only managed to knock down a Prism.

Yeah, they're quite vehicle-heavy.  I'm a huge fan of my skimmer tanks, and I like them much more than Aspect Warriors and Guardians - my 40k army has as many as I can fit as well.  The Guard player was just trying something new - he tends to 'fix' perceived problems in his lists by overcompensating the other way.  Last time he lacked much mobile firepower, and his infantry kept getting gunned down.

Answers from the Eldar player,

After the game against the Tau, I wasn't too sure that a Vampire would be worth it, though I'm having second thoughts now.  I'll probably drop the Hawks and the SWPs from the Guardians to fit one in, assuming I keep with a similar list.

I'm a huge fan of the Prisms, though that may be unwarranted.  I'm just thrilled to see them with a decent gun after being forced to relegate my 40k Prism to paperweight status.  They provide some nice versatility too, since I can always pop heavier infantry with them, and since my list tends to rely on assaults and the Night Spinners for dealing with infantry in general.

They're my norm, in the sense that I've used them for the past two games and intend to use them in the next.  I haven't really been playing long enough to have many norms, sadly.

The Hawks and the SWPs were thrown in to add 200 points to my list, nothing more.  The original plan was to use the Hawks to set up a crossfire at some point, but the 800pt infantry group was too much of an opportunity.  They're not bad, but I think I'd rather do Dire Avengers in a Vampire.  I'm not terribly impressed with Aspects in general, though, and would take a jetbike heavy Saim-hann over Biel-tan if it came down to it.


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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 7:05 am 
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Quote (stugmeister @ 09 Mar. 2006 (11:04))
Does this apply to the Baran Siegemaster list too? If so I may have made a little mistake with my army list in the last battle I had... :D

Well, the thing about limiting upgrades on page 134 of the rulebook only refers to the Steel Legion list. However, on page 72 of Swordwind, it says the following about the Baran Siegemasters:

In addition companies may be given up to three
company upgrades. A company can only take each type
of upgrade once. Each upgrade that is taken adds to the
cost of the company, as shown on the upgrade chart.
Support formations may not be given company
upgrades.


(edited to fix a page number)






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 Post subject: Another BatRep: Ulthwe vs IG 2700
PostPosted: Fri Mar 10, 2006 7:12 am 
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@Gotchaye,

Please tell your eldar player TY for responding.

helpful info all around.

I think the Vampire is a solid piece. I'd encourage him to explore the Aspect combos a bit more. There are some ugly things to be done with dark reapers plus cc specialists. Eldar with full moves after winning combats are also vicous. I highly recommend he explore the aspects a bit more. Especially against the Tau and IG threats. Combat is the bane of both armies.

Now if the spirit stones rules are taken away from the infantry (as they probably should be) then I may back off the cavelier nature of the infantry in the Eldar... but that might be a good thing in the end anyway. ;)

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