Report of my second game vs Glyn is up, in which I attempt to break the Tyranid list by maxing out on Dactylis Synapse Swarms. Enjoy!
http://hordesofthings.blogspot.co.nz/20 ... anids.html
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| 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=84&t=26698 |
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| Author: | Markconz [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 12:42 am ] |
| Post subject: | 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
Report of my second game vs Glyn is up, in which I attempt to break the Tyranid list by maxing out on Dactylis Synapse Swarms. Enjoy! http://hordesofthings.blogspot.co.nz/20 ... anids.html
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| Author: | Dave [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 6:31 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
Thanks for the report guys. StM brought up the cheap Dactylis in Synapse Swarms, although I believe his point had more to do with the Dact Swarm itself costing too much. I've had two games with the Dact in a Synapse Swarm and I'm leaning towards that being too cheap, rather than the Dact swarm being too expensive. What weapons did the 'dule have? Matt and I played a game tonight where he took one with a Cluster Spine and Biocannon. It failed to rally even on a re-roll turn 3, unfortunately not too useful for testing. |
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| Author: | Markconz [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 7:33 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
Cheers guys! And yes Greg that Hive Tyrant gets the "big disappointment" medal! Dave the Hierodule had a razorclaw. Also just to double check I've got this right its only Synapse swarms that get the +2 to rally? So the Independents (Hierodule, Harridan and Biovore in this game) were rallying on 3+ or 4+ with enemy within 30? If so is there a reason the independents are more chicken when rallying? Just in previous lists they've been more reliable that way IIRC. Glyn and I discussed the Dactylis after the game briefly, my pregame thoughts were that they should be 75 in the synapse swarm and Glyn agreed, but perhaps 70, 65 or even the current price is not so bad. 440 is aleady a lot for an Artillery unit as this game showed, especially when they don't start in range, have limited air protection in an army that will usually be charging the enemy rather than defending, and a poor SR. Units like 250 for Manticores (6BP Slow firing starts in range but dies easily) or a VoidSpinner (3BP starts in range and doesn't die easily but perhaps overpowered) are some reference points that suggest maybe they are not that far off and perhaps the Ind Swarm is overpriced, but it's not obvious I think. However, it did seem to me that if you are taking 4 Dactylis the Synapse Swarm is still bit of a no-brainer choice compared to the 4 independent Dactylis, given the rallying bonus and all that extra stuff for 40 points. |
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| Author: | SpeakerToMachines [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:45 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
Nice report, thanks for sharing! Markconz wrote: Also just to double check I've got this right its only Synapse swarms that get the +2 to rally? So the Independents (Hierodule, Harridan and Biovore in this game) were rallying on 3+ or 4+ with enemy within 30? If so is there a reason the independents are more chicken when rallying? Just in previous lists they've been more reliable that way IIRC. That puzzles me a bit too. In my few games with Bio-Titans, they've consistently broken and failed to rally  Of course, my dice hate me...Markconz wrote: Glyn and I discussed the Dactylis after the game briefly, my pregame thoughts were that they should be 75 in the synapse swarm and Glyn agreed, but perhaps 70, 65 or even the current price is not so bad. 440 is aleady a lot for an Artillery unit as this game showed, especially when they don't start in range, have limited air protection in an army that will usually be charging the enemy rather than defending, and a poor SR. Units like 250 for Manticores (6BP Slow firing starts in range but dies easily) or a VoidSpinner (3BP starts in range and doesn't die easily but perhaps overpowered) are some reference points that suggest maybe they are not that far off and perhaps the Ind Swarm is overpriced, but it's not obvious I think. However, it did seem to me that if you are taking 4 Dactylis the Synapse Swarm is still bit of a no-brainer choice compared to the 4 independent Dactylis, given the rallying bonus and all that extra stuff for 40 points. In addition to the (perhaps low) cost of the Dactylis, there's also the opportunity cost, in that you have a synapse swarm that could otherwise be engaging instead babysitting your artillery bugs. I note you ran the Dom without any gants; Is that on purpose? I always take one of each type to allow respawning in the Nexus swarm... |
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| Author: | Markconz [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
SpeakerToMachines wrote: I note you ran the Dom without any gants; Is that on purpose? I always take one of each type to allow respawning in the Nexus swarm... Yes I should have done that cheers. Glyn pointed it out too. As it turned out I managed to spawn just about everything anyway but it is too good an opportunity to leave out. |
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| Author: | GlynG [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 8:54 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
I think it's good that Bio-Titans don't have the +2 to rally. It makes sense for that to tie in to synapse and the tyranid's command creatures and playing against Bio-Titans that auto-rallied outside of 30cm would make them a nightmare to play (it's easier to break them than kills them, for a SM player at least). |
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| Author: | SpeakerToMachines [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 9:38 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
GlynG wrote: I think it's good that Bio-Titans don't have the +2 to rally. It makes sense for that to tie in to synapse and the tyranid's command creatures and playing against Bio-Titans that auto-rallied outside of 30cm would make them a nightmare to play (it's easier to break them than kills them, for a SM player at least). I'm not sure I agree; (1) They are very easy to break, with their low DC. Hard to kill, sure, but they collect blastmarkers quickly and have a hard time shedding them. (2) They're of limited use when not in range to charge into BtB. Also, I just find it strange to see a Tyranid Bio-Titan breaking and cowering in the face of light fire. There should be a genuine sense of "kill it or you're dead" when facing beasts like this (and if necessary a price hike to match); As they are, they're not scary at all, which is about as rude a thing as you can possibly say about a Tyranid... |
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| Author: | fredmans [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:24 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
I often run Dominatrix with Hierodule. After Tyranids went Initiative 1+, I find myself often saving the reroll for rallying independents. /Fredmans |
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| Author: | GlynG [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 10:51 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
I think they're scary and sensible as is. 3+ to rally is excellent by epic standards and it gives the opponent a chance. |
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| Author: | Dave [ Thu Jan 16, 2014 1:41 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: 3K Tyranid (10.2) vs Marine (Day of the Dactylis) |
Markconz wrote: Also just to double check I've got this right its only Synapse swarms that get the +2 to rally? So the Independents (Hierodule, Harridan and Biovore in this game) were rallying on 3+ or 4+ with enemy within 30? If so is there a reason the independents are more chicken when rallying? Just in previous lists they've been more reliable that way IIRC. Everything's 1+ initiative, however synapse swarms ignore the -2 to rally if broken if they have Synapse creatures. If they don't they go to 3+ and the -2 to rally is applied. That's meant to represent the iron will of the hive mind being enforced by the synapse in the swarm. Without the synapse, the independents have some semblance of self preservation. We did try independents benefiting from this special rule, I thought it was a little too unbalanced. I think Chaos creations fall into the "kill it or you're dead" category, and they rally on a 3 or 4+ when broken. If they aren't all that scary we'll take a look at the points along with the armaments. |
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