Tactical Command
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Where's Chaos at???
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=82&t=21361		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  firestorm40k [ Thu Sep 15, 2011 2:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Where's Chaos at???
Hello all :)

So, now that it seems I finally, at long last, will be having some regular EPIC opponents at my gaming group, my army of choice will be Chaos – so I was just wondering where are we at with the Chaos lists?

Is the Black Legion one still the ‘official’ Chaos list? Is that and the L&tD ones developed during the time of Specialist Games the accepted standard ones, or are different ones now ‘official’ (e.g. EpicUK)?

Also, what of the Red Corsairs list? I haven’t paid any attention to its development in a good 18 months, but I always liked this because it put the focus on Renegade Marines, it included Drop Pods and Thunderhawks, and it allowed separate support formations of Cult troops to be fielded – which I prefer to the BL lists method of adding them to a core formation.

Thanks for looking and for any clarification! 8)
Author:  Dave [ Thu Sep 15, 2011 3:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
BL and LatD are the official lists. Both NetEA and EpicUK have added some balance changes to them. The latter being up on their website:

http://www.epic-uk.co.uk/armylists.shtml

The former has the version 1.1 of the handbook, and some forum posts making further changes. The forth coming 1.2 handbook will have it all in one place I believe.

Red Corsairs is BlackLegion's baby I believe.
Author:  frogbear [ Thu Sep 15, 2011 3:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
The last NetEA posts for Chaos are probably found here: viewtopic.php?f=82&t=19860

It also has a range of feedback that one can try to pencil in here and there.

Frankly all this was supposed to be done 9 months ago. With no leadership or encouragement to allow other people to get it done, we are all seeing the effects of empire building.
Author:  CyberShadow [ Thu Sep 15, 2011 11:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
While I entirely acknowledge that development in general has suffered from a lack of strong leadership, I think that it is entirely unfair to start throwing accusations of 'empire building' around without any grounds at all. Please refrain from this kind of comment. If you are unhappy with specific aspects of the current structure then I am more than happy to take these up in a discussion within the community, and I will in fact be opening up the structure and development of all aspects of the game to full discussion, open to all, very shortly. However, dropping personal negative opinions into threads asking for information is unhelpful.
Author:  Onyx [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 12:53 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
The Red Corsair list is defintely good to go. I've been using it for over 2 years now with good results (fair and competetive).
Author:  frogbear [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
CyberShadow wrote:
I think that it is entirely unfair to start throwing accusations of 'empire building'

Well what else do you call the hoarding of information, only referring to a set group of people, and not letting anyone else help even though they have offered many times?

If that is not a 'boy's club', then what is?
Author:  Dave [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:35 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
I think a more apt question is why do you think anyone is doing that? The handbook was farmed out to some dozen people, yourself included, so that they could help put it together. People pitched in, put documents together, and sent them back to get checked over one more time, approved by the NetERC and combined into one big document. All that takes time. Maybe it's not as quick as you like it to be, but posting snotty comments isn't going to improve the situation or help anyone.

Everyone doing this has volunteered their time to do it. No one's getting paid or compensated in any manner. Everyone else who's helped out with the project has somehow refrained from making a conspiracy theory out of this and posting accusations. It might be that that's a hint that perhaps you're out of line.

I really can't see how anyone is "hoarding information", and even if they were what benefit it would be to them. It's not like anyone is sleeping on a pile of these PDFs at night, curling their handlebar mustachios and laughing maniacally.
Author:  Dobbsy [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:40 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
Dave wrote:
It's not like anyone is sleeping on a pile of these PDFs at night, curling their handlebar mustachios and laughing maniacally.

Funniest quote/image of the day :D :D Love it.
Author:  firestorm40k [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:41 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
Goodness, I didn't mean to open a can of worms ::) :-\

So, in a nutshell, the Black Legion list in the EpicUK published Chaos Space Marine 'Codex' is the accepted, tournament standard one; or is it still the SG one? Apologies for my confuzzlement! :-*
Author:  Steve54 [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
firestorm40k wrote:
Goodness, I didn't mean to open a can of worms ::) :-\

So, in a nutshell, the Black Legion list in the EpicUK published Chaos Space Marine 'Codex' is the accepted, tournament standard one; or is it still the SG one? Apologies for my confuzzlement! :-*

The netEA list which should be in the armybook is here viewtopic.php?f=82&t=19001

If you are going to Full scale assault, Into the breech, Counterattack, Open War, Britcon, WPS CC, BOTC, Stockade, EUK GT etc the the EUK list is legal. It is very similar to the netEA list.
Author:  Parintachin [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 8:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
Several good people have worked out good lists for this.

The most recent I've looked at is the Red Corsairs list, and it looks pretty reasonable.
Author:  Jaggedtoothgrin [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 9:15 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
i think that what chaos lists in general need, is more playtesters for the fringier sublists. the core ones (BL, LatD, Corsairs) seem pretty much set and most of what i can see of the others are pretty decently balanced out too, but what they need, is outside input. i know i'd love for someone else to give my list a go, and i imagine that most of the other subACs would too XD
Author:  BlackLegion [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 9:17 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
I didn't received any feedback for imbalances on the Red Corairs for ages. So the list seems to be pretty much finished.
Author:  Steve54 [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 9:18 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
Indeed lack of testing is what is holding most of the 2nd stage lists from moving towards approved - partucularily the World Eaters, Emperors Children and Red Corsairs
Author:  BlackLegion [ Fri Sep 16, 2011 9:29 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Where's Chaos at???
E&C has played +30 games with the Red Corsairs and judges them as tournamend ready. If anything the list is slightly underpowered.
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