I think the issue is building a fully mechanised list doesn't really work with the BL list, as the only ground AA option is unable to be transported. and the aircraft are too fragile to be relied on

It does beg the question if the Black Legion are supposed to play like that, or if a variant list would be the place to put mech Chaos Marines (I do notice that there isn't an active Night Lords list, maybe this gives them the distinctive play style they seem to have lacked).

I don't think that there was any real intent that the Black Legion list focused on a particular play style.

Would Iron Warriors do mechanised list best?

_________________
My TOEG- Blood Angels and Deathbolts
My Painting Blog- Evil Sunz, Goffs
My Epic trades list

Yes IMO, which is part of why I've been arguing that Armoured formations should be Core for them, and not the Black Legion list.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

I don't think mechanization is really the appropriate style for Night Lords, though. As E&C says, Iron Warriors'd make more sense.

_________________
The Apocrypha of Skaros 1.1
Rogue Trader Expedition 0.4
The Horus Heresy 0.5
Night Lords 0.1
My Trade Thread

Or make a list that is just supposed to represent a "non denominational" armoured Chaos list. Iron Warriors come with fluff baggage that it might be nice to do without

What's wrong with their fluff?

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

Well we can justify about 10-12 different CSM lists. The 9 original Legions, plus chapters/warbands that have gone rogue subsequently e.g. Red Corsairs.

It would be nice for each of them to have something distinctive. If we start inventing new lists beyond those then it becomes progressively harder to justify each list by making it distinctive enough.

Iron Warriors are one of the 5 original unaligned Legions. They should be reasonably flexible in terms of units, albeit not quite as much as Black Legion. So I am not sure what fluff baggage would rule them out. They would have lots of firepower and lots of armour. I definitely think that they could do mechanised CSM the best.

What would you gain by "non denominational" armoured Chaos list?

And a proper Night Lords list would be cool too- something that would encapsulate their hit and run style of attacks- similarities perhaps to loyalist White Scar list. (In W40K 4th ed I was working on a Night Lords army for Cityfight- all infantry with furious charge/infiltrate and whole load of Raptors).

Cheers

James

_________________
My TOEG- Blood Angels and Deathbolts
My Painting Blog- Evil Sunz, Goffs
My Epic trades list

I've been pondering a Night Lords list over the past day or two, actually. I'll post up some concepts at some point.

The Iron Warriors storming forces are "based around fast moving heavy armour". Seems a good enough fit - fortifications, some heavy armour, and some infantry. Knock off for lunch.

_________________
The Apocrypha of Skaros 1.1
Rogue Trader Expedition 0.4
The Horus Heresy 0.5
Night Lords 0.1
My Trade Thread

Nothing.

_________________
Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.

??

_________________
My TOEG- Blood Angels and Deathbolts
My Painting Blog- Evil Sunz, Goffs
My Epic trades list

I've played about half a dozen games with the new developmental Iron Warriors list.

I'd LOVE to see some form of mechanised AA for the list (and I guess it would follow on for the BL list aswell).
Oblits are great but in the Iron Warriors list, they are still 85pts each. Even at 75pts, they are too expensive. If you add enough to give adequate AA, the activation count is severely reduced.

The main time it's a problem is when the opponent get to activate first on the 1st turn (this happens a lot to me lately as I seem to be a master a rolling 1's for the strategy roll...). The fighters are not about on CAP and the Oblits are best served in Terminator formations (or too expensive to sitting around in the deployment zone just in case the opponent gets to go first). Facing Marines or Eldar with no AA cover is always going to be a tough ask.

I like the idea of a Defiler AA variant (a lot) but it is a little slow and doesn't quite fit in with the formations that need the AA cover (as E&C mentioned). I think the Stalker is the best option and it was ok'd by Jervis if I recall correctly. I've only played a few games with BL over the years (I've played dozens with the Red Corsairs but they have the Hunter) but I presume they have the same issue as the Iron Warriors.

_________________
Just call me Steve.

NetEA Rules Chair
NetEA FAQ

Want to play Iron Warriors in Epic Armageddon? Click HERE
Some of my Armies.
My Hobby site.

The Iron Warriors list could justify Hydras or captured modified Whirlwinds, IMO.

I'm honestly not sure this is an unreasonable limitation for Chaos forces to have, though. If there is difficulty, perhaps air cover should be made more affordable? Or give Chaos access to Thunderhawks. They certainly appear enough in the fiction.

This does feel a little like one of the natural restrictions of the list is about to be removed because it's a restriction. It feels a little like solving Marines' difficulties with Titans by giving them some superheavies.

_________________
The Apocrypha of Skaros 1.1
Rogue Trader Expedition 0.4
The Horus Heresy 0.5
Night Lords 0.1
My Trade Thread

Onyx: Jervis ok'd both the Stalker and the AA Defiler as worthy concepts for playtesting. Especially the Stalker as he thought it unlikely that Marines would have had no AA vehicle pre-heresy.

_________________
Currently doing a plastic scenery kickstarter

The Stalker has two problems to my mind. It seems to be a simple copying of a Marine vehicle which seems like a cop-out. We also have to deal with the idea of why that unit was replaced by the current Marine AA unit and why it is one of the very few pre-Heresy units that didn't make it to current times.

It is an inelegant solution and one that fits one specific type of army building.

_________________
Guns don't break formations. Blast Markers break formations.