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For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x

 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2020 8:25 am 
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I found out from a mate why the British and colonial armies like Australia, NZ canada, etc salute with the ir palm out and other countries salute with their palm down. It seems the british army were strict about clean hands and uniforms, so you had to show you had cleaned your hands. Other armies follow the british marines tradition of hiding their dirty hands when they salute.

Back to the list. A person on facebook keeps providing me with advice on the list. Some of it I agree with, but I want to test the current list before any more changes are made.

Suggestions are:
1- Dropping the price of the core formations, because when compared to other lists the elysians are well over the average of 20 points per unit. You lose 15cm in range, even though the main force will be dropped close to the enemy, once they settle down, the extra 15cm does make a differrence, and the list does not reallt have any anvil units like tank companies, artillery companies, titans, etc. He said a drop in price will allow for more glass units on the table.

My alternate suggestion which should allow for the drop companies to be larger and still not cost too many points would be to drop the cost of the upgrades. for example 2 hardened veterans for 25 points, 2 cyclops for 25 points, 2 fire support units for 25 points. I calculated that a core formation at 225 points with 2 hardened veterans, 2 fie support units, 2 cyclops, a spotter and a sabre would cost 350 points for 15 units and the character. This would make it a reduction in price from 28 points a unit down to 24 points a unit. Still more points per unit than the standard imperial guard, but I suppose you have to factor in the ability to drop droops enmasse, even with the shortened 30cm range.

An alternative would be to drop the core company formation price down to 180 points making them 22.5 points each.

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 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2020 1:41 pm 
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That is an interesting piece if history I didn't know. We salute hand down obviously, being in the Infantry and other combat branches it would be pretty hard to keep your hands clean ! 8)

Those are interesting suggestions, but yes you may have to try them out in a game or two ...

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 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:24 pm 
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That's putting them in popcorn area. I like the idea though of increasing sizes for the price, even a little, and then low cost upgrades. We might actually see them taken in this list.

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 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Thu Aug 06, 2020 2:47 pm 
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True ... but trying it out gives you an idea ...

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 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2020 8:29 am 
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Yeah, I just have to organise a game. My nearest Epic gamer who know what they are doing is based about 50-60Km away on the other side of Sydney. There is a regular meet on the first Saturday of the month, but the last meeting was cancelled due to the quarantining from covid.

I do not have the room to set my table up at my new house. I played a game at the local gaming shop when restrictions were relaxed. I played a game against myself using Ghazghuls orks vs my Elysians, but that was against the self planetfall list. It took forever as I had to record the game urns each formations actions, etc, and take photos. It was a win for the Elysians - just, but I did not have much in the way of TK or MW artillery for the orks, and we had nearly the same amount of activations. Plus most of the Elysians arrived on turn 2, and the space ship arrived on turn 1.

I could try another game at the hall of Heroes, but that looks wierd playing against yourself, and you already know the tactics oyur opponent will use. I have a couple mates who are learning the game from me, but they still need to develop their knowledge of the game, and their armies abilities. George has back problems and a short attention span, but has Blood angels/marines, necrons (now that Todd has dropp off the face of the earth and handed them back to me), his 2 daughters have Bieltan Eldar (which Nick returned as he dislike the game) and Squats, and finally Jimbo, but he has the Ghazghul Orks I gave him, and has only 1 gargant, some stompas and almost no experience at all. He also works weekends, and needs a lift to get anywhere. So as you see it has been hard to organise anything.

I think I will try the 4.2.0 list first before I even look at trying anything new. I know this list will need a lot more glass formations to last long enough to finish the game with some of them still intact.

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 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Fri Aug 07, 2020 3:17 pm 
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Good luck on your quest !

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 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Tue Sep 01, 2020 7:22 pm 
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Is there any desire to continiue developing this list?
What would NetERC require for this list to finalise it's development?

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 Post subject: Re: For Elysia! The Elysian Drop Troop Regiment v3.x
PostPosted: Wed Sep 02, 2020 8:07 am 
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I have been developing the version 4.X Elysian list in another thread. There is definately a desire to develop this list, as it had been complained about for having too much teleport, which was deemed unable to deal with.

I have been working on changing the deployment method, which is now set at planetfall (self-Planetfall was a dismal failure). The army has had a slight restructure with a mortar company added, as well as upgrade options for a spotter character, the Sabre ground based AA unit, and a change to the role of Hardened Veterans to the close combat units in a company.

I added the grey ghosts (formatoin limit of 1) to fill the scout/garrison role supporting the scout sentinel. I added 2 more units to the Taurus/Venator, Drop/ Support/ Scout sentinel Squadrons at +50 points fo the 2.

I dropped the size of the lightning squadron down to 2, and also dropped the price of the drop companies as they had lost the nasty teleport trick, and they still had no armour and a short 30cm ranged weapon for every 2 units. They were about 19 points a unit, and thye are now 22 points a unit, where most other guard armies have their troop units at 20 point or less per unit. Thus they are still cost more than regular imperial guard, just not half as much again.

I also added in an allied (1/3 allocation) line breaker formation in case you though you needed leman russes and chimera mount basic guard troopers, but it is 300 points, and eats into oyur precious 1/3 allotment needed for the spacecraft, and lightnings.

I have also been developing the Paramar air cav/drop regiment as a test bed for any changes to the Elysian 4.x list, testing them before working out what is good, and what will not work. I have been trying to achieve a balanced army that is thematic. One that does not create an OP list that is hard to deal withor have a wierd popcorn effect when creating the army. On average I can build an army with between 12 and 14 formations, with those that have a higher formation count, not having any formations with over 9 units. The ones with 12 formations had some formations with 15 units, but most had between 8 and 11 units for the core companies, and 6 units for the support formations.

The way I see it, the army either has more formations that are easily broken, and then wiped out by BM, or they have slightly larger formations, but has fewer of them.

The army has to be maticulously planned so you can overwhelm an enemy, by planetfall. If planed wrong, the enemy can counter your drop and assault, and then destroy your smaller easily broken formations. Anyone with artillery, especially gargant/titan mounted artillery can wipe your army out, and even the grey ghosts can be wiped out in a single round of shooting from one Supa-Stompa.

As far as I can see the version 4,x version is pretty much close to ready. My version 1.02 version of the Paramar drop degiment is about where I want them, if not that version, the 1.01 version. But the changes are mostly just points cost changes to balance things out. I have not laded the 1.01 and 1,02 versions yet to the website as I am still trying to work out which is the fairest.

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