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True Steel Legion
BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 12:55 pm 
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Oops overlooked it:
NO Vanquisher.
1. It is expressely forbidden in the Codex.
2. There is only ONE forgeworld left (frominitially two)in the Galaxy which produces Vanquishers.
3. The Vanquishers forgeworld isn't Armageddon.

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 12:57 pm 
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? Hows that, which codex says no Vanquishers. There are two vanquisher patterns, they can be made on other forgeworlds (Mars can make everything for instance).

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:06 pm 
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Codex Armageddon says ist right there in the Steel Legion PDF section.

So my sources are:
Codex Armageddon
- forbids Ogryns, Ratling-Snipers, Rough Riders, Deathworld Sentinels, Vanquishers and Exterminators.
- States that all Sentinels, Basilisks and Griffons must have Enclosed Cabines.
- allowes Hive Ganger Militia (= Conscripts)

The Doctrines given in Codex Imperial Guards
- Mechanised
- Stormtroopers
- Xeno-Fighter: Orks
- Ratling Snipers
- Conscript Platoons
(this disallows: Priests, Enginseers, Sanktioned Psykers, Ogryns, Special Weapon Squads, Rough Riders and Fire Support Squads)

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:36 pm 
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- You think this formation is unessecary?


Yes very much so.

- I found no reference, that the Stormblade is used by the Steel Legion.

Just because it's not mentioned in the one or two pages' worth of info on the Steel Legion doesn't mean we can't extrapolate and assume its (To me, likely) presence.


2. There is only ONE forgeworld left (frominitially two)in the Galaxy which produces Vanquishers.

No, there are only two designs, both of which are produced on multiple Forgeworlds.

See page 11 of Imperial Armour Vol 1, where it discusses how designs are disseminated across the Imperium.

Also note page 12 of the same book, which talks about a Laser-Destroyer version of the Chimera known as the 'Defender' which was used in the Armageddon war presumably by the Steel Legion.


Going from AP4+/AT4+ to AP4+/AT2+ really isn't worth 25 points!

Then you get rid of the nonsense option to take 10 normal Leman Russ. It's a stupid option which has never, ever been used in tournament style games.

Plus, plenty of people do think it's worth taking, as they take Vanquishers in their Russ Companies when using the Minervan list.


Codex Armageddon says ist right there in the Steel Legion PDF section.

Hasn't codex Armageddon been overwritten by the newer IG codex? For example Ratlings are now allowed, and so are Vanquishers.

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:43 pm 
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re Stormblade: opps forgot to mention Imperial Armour 1 as scource. I skimmed the Pictures and Fluff section for references if a particular vehicle is Armageddon Pattern (so the Medusa and Stormsword got in) and/or if it is used by the Steel Legion (here i found the reference to Leman Russ Exterminators).

re Codex Armageddon: Yes and no. Vanquishers aren't in Codex Imperia lGuard any more. So are Griffons and all other Leman Russ variants apart from the Demolisher.

Now i don't have accsess to IA 1 anymore. What exactly does it say about the "Defender"?

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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:45 pm 
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i don't have accsess to IA 1 anymore. What exactly does it say about the "Defender"?


It's described as a Chimera outfitted with a Laser Destroyer during the Armageddon war, there's little more info than that. The hulls seem to have been built on Armageddon itself (It builds many Chimeras) but I'd doubt that they'd be able to make the gun on-site.


re Stormblade: opps forgot to mention Imperial Armour 1 as scource.

Indeed, I checked it myself... two pages of pictures seems too little to rule out this tank IMHO.




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BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 1:57 pm 
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So it is basically a Tank Destroyer with 5+ armour instead of 4+RA and 30cm speed instead of 20cm (a Chimera with a Laser-Destroyer and no transport space)? I could include this.

The palsmacoil technologiy for the Plasma Blastgun seems to be pretty rare. I don't know if Armageddon is capable to build this.

Edit: The only proof for Stormblades in the Steel Legion is the Dawn of Steel fan-made expansion for Dawn of War :D




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Evil and Chaos
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 2:18 pm 
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I don't know if Armageddon is capable to build this.


Armageddon is a major warzone supplied by a dozen Forgeworlds ; The mere fact that their main army is a mechanised force tells you that this army is supplied very, very well.




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BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Sun Jun 01, 2008 2:22 pm 
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Yes, now during the war. Expecially Steel Legion Regiments which are Tithed ones and came back to defend their homeworld have acsess to almost any equipment.
But this list is for the PDF which never has left Armageddon and in the majority is supplied with Armageddon-only stuff.
I keep off-Armageddon equipment to a minimum. Because of this Shadowswords, Deathstrikes and Hydras are in there because they fill an importand hole in the army.

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 11:17 am 
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Tried out a bit different:

Restructured the unit composition of the Regimental HQ and renamed it Command Platoon.

Renamend Infantry Company and Mechanised Infantry Company toPlatoons respectively.

Removed Shadowswords from Super-heavy Tank Company (too rare)

Removed Mechanised Infantry Platoon from the Support Formations

Removed Command unit from Hive Militia Conscripts Company and renamed it Hive Militia Conscripts Platoon.

Renamend Infantry Platoon Upgrade to Armoured Fist and made it only available for Companies.

Added Sentinel Squadron of 3 Armageddon Pattern Sentinels as Upgrades.

Added Conquerers to the Tank Squadron Upgrade (to better remain in pace with the Chimeras and Conquerors seems to be in use by the Steel Legion)

Other ideas: Replace Thunderbolts with Lightnings:
Armour 6+
Twin Lascannons 45 cm AT4+/AA5+
Underwing Rockets 30cm AT4+

With this stats perhabs remove the Marauder?




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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:14 pm 
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Lightning stats that have been tested lots
Fighter
save 6+
Twin wingtip lascannon 30cm AT4+/AA5+ Fixed forward
Hydra Autocannon 45cm, AP5+/AT6+/AA6+ Fixed forward
2 for 175

Strike
Fighter
save 6+
Twin wingtip lascannon 30cm AT4+/AA5+ Fixed forward
3 x Twin Missiles 30cm AT5+ Fixed forward (which is I think better than 6 AT6+, but thats one way of downgrading it)
2 for 200

Apparently it can have 6 missiles, anyone got that on there's? I've only got 4. That would alter things.

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 12:21 pm 
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Because the rulebook Thunderbolt is a simplified Thunderbolt i would simplify the two Lightnings into one stat.

In Apocalypse the Lightning can have 4 rockets or 4 bombs and can replace its Lb Autocannon with 2 rockts too. So that would be 6 rockets in total for the "Strike"

But what do you think about the other changes i made? It is only a test to see peoples opinion.




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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Wed Jun 04, 2008 2:30 pm 
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Aircraft wise how many missiles do peoples strike varients have? I could have sworn mine had 4.

As for simplification its a big change, ones an air superiority fighter, the other a bomber.

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BlackLegion
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 12:10 am 
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Hmm so the two profiles for Lightnings and Lightning Strikes are well tested you say?
I would like to use them instead of Thunderbolts to give the Steel Legion PDF one more difference to the Rulebook/Tithed Steel Legion.

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: True Steel Legion
PostPosted: Thu Jun 05, 2008 12:13 am 
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Funnily enough I use them with the motor brigade as well (another mech formation).

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