Tactical Command
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3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
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Author:  novemberrain [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 2:00 pm ]
Post subject:  3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
First here is the list im thinking of:

TACTICAL DETACHMENT [400]
6 Tacticals, 3 Rhinos, Supreme Commander
TACTICAL DETACHMENT [350]
6 Tacticals, 3 Rhinos, Librarian
DEVASTATOR DETACHMENT [325]
4 Devastators, Hunter, 2 Rhinos
DEVASTATOR DETACHMENT [325]
4 Devastators, Hunter, 2 Rhinos
ASSAULT DETACHMENT [225]
4 Assault units, Chaplain
ASSAULT DETACHMENT [225]
4 Assault units, Chaplain
LAND RAIDERS [450]
4 Land Raiders, Chaplain
WHIRLWINDS [300]
4 Whirlwinds
THUNDERHAWK [200]
THUNDERHAWK [200]

Now questions:

I am not sure about the character choice and placement. I have put a chaplain in with the land raiders to make them BTS and for the inspiring, but im not sure?

Do i have too many character upgrades?

Do I have enough AA with the 2 hunters and the 2 thunderhawks?

Thanks guys!
Author:  Simulated Knave [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 5:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
You're not using the current NetEA list, then?

A Librarian would work better than the Chaplain, IMO.

Whether that's enough AA depends on how much A people usually bring.
Author:  novemberrain [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 5:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
Using the SM list as it is in the GW printed rulebook.

Why would the librarian be better than the chaplain? Is the chance of hitting with the FF MW attack really better than the inspiring?
Author:  Simulated Knave [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 5:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
Using the NetEA SM list would save you about 125 points.

Personally, I'd see the Librarian as a better choice simply based on its ability to kill stuff. I like it when my enemy's stuff dies - and Marines lack a lot of MW to make that happen. A Land Raider detachment should probably be a supporting element in most combats anyway, what with the lack of numbers (a Tactical detachment's better than them), and on that level I don't think they need to bring a Chaplain along.

Of course, it'd probably make even more sense to put a Librarian in with the Devastators. :P
Author:  novemberrain [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
[quote="Simulated Knave"]
Using the NetEA SM list would save you about 125 points.
/quote]
It would also cost me half my opponents so not really an option.

You see I would have moved the librarian from tacticals and the Chaplain on the LR into the two devastator detachments as Librarians, but then that leaves me with my SC formation as my BTS - something I don't like the idea of...
Author:  Simulated Knave [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
It's actually a pretty common tactic - you already want to protect the SC, so it costs you nothing and means you don't have to try to preserve another formation as well.
Author:  novemberrain [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 7:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
Hmmm re-written the list.

TACTICAL DETACHMENT [475]
6 Tacticals, 3 Rhinos, Supreme Commander, Hunter
TACTICAL DETACHMENT [300]
6 Tacticals, 3 Rhinos
DEVASTATOR DETACHMENT [300]
4 Devastators, 2 Rhinos, Librarian
DEVASTATOR DETACHMENT [375]
4 Devastators, Hunter, 2 Rhinos, Librarian
ASSAULT DETACHMENT [225]
4 Assault units, Chaplain
ASSAULT DETACHMENT [225]
4 Assault units, Chaplain
LAND RAIDERS [400]
WHIRLWINDS [300]
THUNDERHAWK [200]
THUNDERHAWK [200]

1 Supreme Commander, 2 Librarians and 2 Chaplains, 250pts of characters too much? Moved the hunter to make the SC tactical formation the BTS.
Author:  Evil and Chaos [ Sat Mar 17, 2012 8:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
Quote:
TACTICAL DETACHMENT [400]
6 Tacticals, 3 Rhinos, Supreme Commander
TACTICAL DETACHMENT [350]
6 Tacticals, 3 Rhinos, Librarian
DEVASTATOR DETACHMENT [325]
4 Devastators, Hunter, 2 Rhinos
DEVASTATOR DETACHMENT [325]
4 Devastators, Hunter, 2 Rhinos
ASSAULT DETACHMENT [225]
4 Assault units, Chaplain
ASSAULT DETACHMENT [225]
4 Assault units, Chaplain
LAND RAIDERS [450]
4 Land Raiders, Chaplain
WHIRLWINDS [300]
4 Whirlwinds
THUNDERHAWK [200]
THUNDERHAWK [200]


Rulebook Space Marine list?

Forget the Land Raiders. Rulebook Land Raiders were under-statted and greatly overpriced. A losing choice.

Take Terminators. Rulebook Terminators were underpriced and awesome.

I'd suggest putting your Librarian with Devestators, not Tacticals.
Author:  Dobbsy [ Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:07 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
I've always felt character placement a matter of tasking.

Chaplain provides a Close Combat bonus via Inspiring so I'd usually place them in a formation dedicated to engagements. e.g. Assault, Terminators, Bikes etc all have 3+CC so you'll hit more often thus meaning more possible kills on top of the inspiring bonus.

Librarians give a strong MW Firefight attack so placing them in a strong FF formation is a good idea. e.g. Devastators/Terminators have a 3+FF.

Captains let you assault with multiple formations through the Commander rule so these guys can go anywhere.

Just my 2cents
Author:  wargame_insomniac [ Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
I would agree with Dobbsy in where I put my SM characters
Author:  novemberrain [ Sun Mar 18, 2012 10:55 am ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
The second list posted above has Librarians in the Devastators, Chaplains in the assault marines and the SC in the Tacticals, seems to fit into your suggestions pretty well.

I think I will base the characters on seperate little counters so I can place them near whichever formations I want.
Author:  Dobbsy [ Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
Not an all-together bad idea. The only problem with it lies in what your opponents see on the table. By the letter, the character should really be placed in a unit so there's no "forgetting by accident" or "misunderstanding" of what formation he's with during a complicated or messy engagement etc. "Wait. he's with which unit? I forget..." and "What unit was he with again..?"
Basically try to make it easy for your opponent in a game by cutting confusion. I usually make up separate units with each character type on them to slot in if necessary. That way you can leave them out if you need to as well.
Author:  stompzilla [ Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
I have my marines based on 2 pence pieces (Cheapest bases ever!) and the characters have little magnets glued to the bases, so I can swap and change them about between games.
Author:  novemberrain [ Sun Mar 18, 2012 12:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: 3k Vanilla Space Marines list - some questions.
I do the same with my exarchs in my eldar and the icon bearers and champions in my chaos armies. I base them on 5p's and place them touching the stand of infantry to which they are attached. I might make up the supreme commander as a full base, but chaplains I think can be left on 5p's.

Thanks guys.
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