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Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf

 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 8:35 am 
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Hmm well I haven't actually used the list yet, or ever used termis in landraiders :D Will see how it goes.

Crusader... will check out the Storm Bolter hatches the guard vehicles used to come with I guess...

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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 2:07 pm 
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Scout Bikers: Am I the only one who feels like these are marginally over priced? They're worse on armor saves, CC and FF compared to regular bikers, and only gain Scout as a payback for it. Admittedly this means they can garrison, but with lower survivability and kill power, I'm not sure how good this would be. I might suggest moving their FF value back to 4+ since they've got the same kinds of ranged weapons normal Bikers do, and then you're giving up survivability and close-combat punch in favor of Scouts. Dunno if that'd make them too good or not, but I'm curious on the thought-process for the scout bikers.


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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Thu Dec 06, 2007 3:03 pm 
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I was planning to use them anyway, really. They just look kinda weedy compared to the regular marine bikes when you look at stat changes vs advantages is all!  :laugh:

Haven't used them yet, but will almost certainly do two units of them. If there's one thing that fighting Necrons so much has taught me it's that having screening formations is invaluable. >.> <.<


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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 4:36 am 
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Minor wording tweak suggestion:

"The Land Raider Crusader was designed (delete extra words) as a close support tank. Its (no apostrophe) Lascannons are replaced with Hurricane Bolters, for heavy targets there is a Multimelta, and instead of a Heavy Bolter there are Twin Assault Cannons to fend off any type of infantry. (individual clauses separated by comma's and language tweaked) The Crusader variant was first created by the Black Templar Chapter but is also utilised by other Chapters. Scions of Iron use the Land Raider Crusader in two roles. First it acts as a support tank for Land Raiders,  deployed to prevent surprises when the fighting is expected to include close range fire. Their second role is to act as assault transports and heavy close support for infantry. Both Terminators and regular marines can be deployed with Land Raider Crusaders when the need arises."

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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 4:58 am 
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Replace 'created' with 'discovered' and you've got pretty much perfect background material right there, I think!


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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Fri Dec 07, 2007 11:57 pm 
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And just to get the 'totally impractical theme army' out of the way... Absurd numbers of Land Raiders!

Land Raiders Much?
3,000 Points

Land Raider Helios - BTS
+Hunter
Cost: 575

Land Raiders
+Prometheus
+Hunter
Cost: 525

Land Raiders
+Hunter
+Chaplain
Cost: 475

Land Raiders
+Hunter
+Chaplain
Cost: 475

Land Raiders
+Hunter
+Chaplain
Cost: 475

Land Raiders
+Hunter
+Chaplain
Cost: 475

Alternatively pull  the Hunters out  of the non-SC Land Raider units and take 4 Thunderbolts. Probably not practical at all, but neat!






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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 1:02 am 
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Well, used my Scions against Corey's eldar today, lost pretty handily due to a combination of poor tactics on my part and bad rolling mostly. Three Scorpions and a pair of Revenants will really ruin this list's day. Combine that with me failing bunches of saving throws and losing a Warhound on turn 1 to a group of falcons and firestorms and the end result was me conceeding the game in turn 2 with virtually nothing left on the field. Not sure I'd claim it was really the list's problem so much as me not being used to them though (That, and suffering seven hits off the Falcons on turn one didn't help either!)


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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 2:55 pm 
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Mark_Logue and I had a 4000pt game a few weeks ago.
I used the Scions list.

It was the 1st time I'd played a full game using Marines and it took me a lot of getting used to the smaller force (I usually play Orks and Guard). I was heavily out-numbered and showed quite a bit of inexperience with getting the most out of my firepower (the best, or worst, example of this was forgetting to teleport on my 2nd Terminator formation, with their Chaplain! ). There was a certain amount of bad fortune against me (in one round I hit his Leman Russ Tank company (BTS) 12 times only to have the reinforced armour save everytime... including a character save from the Commisar, D'oh!

I did maul his infantry companies (there were 4 of them) and his Stormtroopers in Valkyries were thrashed by a single Terminator detachment. He shot down one of my Thunderhawk CAS with a critical hit in the first round but the other dealt death everywhere it went (love that unit). My Tactical detachment, reinforced with Vindicators was suprisingly powerful.

Upshot was that I didn't have an effective plan for turn 3 and that cost me the game. I really like the list and will definately be using it in the future.

Thanks Hena for putting it together.

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 Post subject: Scions of Iron v1.2gw/epic/Scions_of_Iron_v1.2.pdf
PostPosted: Mon Dec 10, 2007 3:33 pm 
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(Hena @ Dec. 10 2007,07:44)
QUOTE
The list has certain problem. If your opponent knows in advance what list you play ... it becomes hard. Enough MW and AT weapons and Marine tanks have problems. Luckily in here we nowdays play mainly blinds (set up time for a 3k game and don't tell armies beforehand).

This is something of a problem locally, which I should really talk to Corey about really. He has a tendency to show up and build his list on the spot, which can yield some pretty nasty things depending on how he does so!


Anyway, short batrep was something like:

Edge to edge deployment, river with two bridges running across a good chunk of the SM board-edge. Land Raider dets set up on one side, with a Warhound and heavy tacs, Scout Bikes and a Warhound set up on the other side. Warhound 1 doubled forward, shot at his Scorpions, did one point of damage. Falcons sustained on Warhound 1 and in a flurry of good rolls for him and horrible rolls for me killed it instantly (5 hits through shields, and only 1 save!) Other warhound moved up to shoot at something, don't remember what, but it didn't manage to do anything significant that I recall. Scorpions shot Warhound 2 and broke it. Raiders 1 doubled forwards to attack his Scorpions, failed to do much of anything. Stormserpent marched across the field, retained with his Fire Dragons to assault my Land Raider det, obliterated the Land Raiders and took no damage in return. Heavy Tacs advanced on his Fire Dragons and, thanks to the Prometheus, killed four of them and broke the unit. Revenants advanced (Doubled maybe?) forwards and shot at the Heavy Tacs, wiped out all the tac marines and the hunter but both land raiders survived to run away. Thunderhawk SB came in, attacked his Guardians in the woods, wiped out most of the unit but not the Farseer. Other Land Raider Det shot at his Stormserpent I think but failed to do anything meaningful. Both scout bike formations moved up the field but didn't do anything significant. At this point I'd broken two of his formations and he'd wiped out one of mine. At this point I had Terminators (off board), 1 Land Raider, 1 Land Raider Prometheus, 2 Land Speeder Tornados and 8 Scout Bikes on the field.

Turn 2 consisted of me teleporting in the terminators, losing the initiative roll, his Scorpions shooting my Terminators but only killing one stand, then me using a unit of scout bikers and the terminators to assault the scorpions, and losing (badly) in the resolution by losing by like 5 points (With only the chaplain left alive I was pretty well doomed there). At which point I conceeded the game. I think Land Raider Det 2 died somewhere as well, but I can't recall how or where exactly.


My thoughts: Hunters are -still- fantastically over priced pieces of crap IMHO. 75 points each is absurd for an AA unit which dies so easily (5+ save) and can't be buried inside a unit with lots of ablative tanks the way the IG can. 50 points would make vastly more sense and maybe make me want to field these things again instead of Thunderbolts, but as it stands I'm probably going to take a flight or two of Thunderbolts instead (Not that it matters  much, I rarely see more then one formation of aircraft anyway!)






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