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Marine section
Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 4:53 pm 
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Quote (primarch @ 09 Nov. 2005 (15:05))
Hi!

I sometimes wonder if it is a worthwhile project to produce an updated "heresy-era" TOE. Based on the SM1, but expanded and updated.

Primarch

I think it would be worthwhile.  :cool:

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primarch
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Wed Nov 09, 2005 10:54 pm 
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Quote (Dwarf Supreme @ 09 Nov. 2005 (10:53))
Quote (primarch @ 09 Nov. 2005 (15:05))
Hi!

I sometimes wonder if it is a worthwhile project to produce an updated "heresy-era" TOE. Based on the SM1, but expanded and updated.

Primarch

I think it would be worthwhile. ?:cool:

Hi!

Perhaps now that NetEpic Gold is rolling, I need to make a new queue of things to do.

I will add it to that list.

Primarch

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 12:14 am 
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Thanks Tas, We still use modified SM1 TO&Es for SMs, IG, Orks, Squat and Chaos ...  The big problem IMO, with 40K fluff and Epic is not only scale, (both model size and units !) but G/W; IMO has a problem interfacing 40K with Epic.  Made even worse now that Epic is the "old weird  uncle" no one wants to talk about ... but us !  :;):

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Markconz
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 1:52 am 
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Quote (Bombot @ 09 Nov. 2005 (14:13))
?But my point is that the Deathwing and Ravenwing are only very slightly more powerful in 40k than regular terminators or bike units. ?At Epic scale I think one could argue that the difference isn?t big enough to warrant any difference in stats.

I agree, I personally think all the variant Marine lists are unecessary.

In 40k they are just excuses to sell more marines. Space marines alone outsell the entire fantasy range apparantly.

Now I'm stopping before I start to sound like Primarch... :p

BTW I would also like to see some Horus Heresy era lists...

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Bombot
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:33 am 
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Quote (Markconz @ 10 Nov. 2005 (00:52))
In 40k they are just excuses to sell more marines. Space marines alone outsell the entire fantasy range apparantly.

I'll be charitable (even if I agree with you  :;):) and say that any variant Marine lists should prioritise those Chapters that really are different.  So Space Wolves should be first prioirity.  Any others can really be represented by unit selection within the standard Marine list.

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Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 3:46 pm 
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Quote (Markconz @ 10 Nov. 2005 (00:52))
Now I'm stopping before I start to sound like Primarch... :p

You make that sound like a bad thing!  :p  :D

I agree, I think most of the variant Marine lists are unnecessary. I thought the four chapters with separate cards in SM2 were okay, since they were sufficiently different, but at the rate we're going, [/B]every[B] SM chapter will have its own list in E:A. Surely energy spent on developing Marine lists would be better spent on other lists.

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Bombot
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:39 pm 
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Quote (Dwarf Supreme @ 10 Nov. 2005 (14:46))
I thought the four chapters with separate cards in SM2 were okay, since they were sufficiently different

Which ones were they?  I presume Space Wolves were one.

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Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Nov 10, 2005 4:53 pm 
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Quote (Bombot @ 10 Nov. 2005 (15:39))
Quote (Dwarf Supreme @ 10 Nov. 2005 (14:46))
I thought the four chapters with separate cards in SM2 were okay, since they were sufficiently different

Which ones were they? ?I presume Space Wolves were one.

Ultramarines, Space Wolves, Blood Angles, Dark Angels. Now that I think about, there weren't any specific Ultramarine cards, but they were cited for being a chapter that was organised according to the Codex. The generic Marine cards in SM2 were for codex chapters.

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 6:22 am 
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What would be different about space wolves?
Bigger company size - so what? They have 4 tac detachments per company? Terminators - 20 per great company so standard size again. Etc. What would be the differences?

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Dwarf Supreme
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 3:28 pm 
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Quote (The_Real_Chris @ 07 Dec. 2005 (05:22))
What would be different about space wolves?
Bigger company size - so what? They have 4 tac detachments per company? Terminators - 20 per great company so standard size again. Etc. What would be the differences?

I don't remember off the top of my head exactly how, but in SM2 Space Wolves were organized slightly differently from other chapters. I'll have to check out my army cards when I get home and let you know.

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Lion in the Stars
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Wed Dec 07, 2005 7:57 pm 
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So, should I bust out the .PDF I made of my EA Space Wolf fanlist?  I haven't touched it since the SG forum re-org, though I'm told it plays well.  I also have a DA list I could post, but they need more work.

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 1:36 am 
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IIRC an SM2 SW Great Company was 2 Tac dets of 10 Fire Tms (stands) and 5 Rhinos each (20/10) and a HQ of 4 Terminators or 4 Tac. Cmd Stands and 2 Land Raiders ...

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The_Real_Chris
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 11:56 am 
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Hmm, you could do space wolves like an Imperial guard epic army. Detachments like Tac as company picks then HQs and similar as support units. Keep the same costs formations sizes etc wherever possible but would give it a different feel.

So can anyone list the founding chapters and how each one differs?

No rules, just the fluff.

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nealhunt
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 4:44 pm 
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Codex:
=====
Ultras
Imperial Fists - (siege specialists, but basically codex)
Raven Guard - (guerilla specialists)

Dark Angels - close to Codex, but they have the Ravenwing company (all bikes/speeders).  Older fluff also had the Ironwing as a specialty armor company, now gone.  Other minor equpment differences (more termie armor and a tendency toward plasma weapons).

Blood Angels - Blood rage geneseed defect ("Death Company" berzerkers) and minor equipment differences (speed/assault).  Other than that, basically codex.

Salamanders - Slower and steadier (high-grav world) and minor equipment differences (focusing on heat/flames).  Other than that, basically codex.

Space Wolves - "wolf-like" unstable geneseed.  Battle roles are based on seniority (young guys assault, old guys heavy weapons).  Companies/formations are larger than Codex.

White Scars - Bikes, bikes, bikes.  It's basically a codex org, but with 2x or more the number of bikes available.  Tactical emphasis on speed.

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Legion 4
 Post subject: Marine section
PostPosted: Thu Dec 08, 2005 5:00 pm 
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We still use the SM1 SM TO&Es with some SM2 stuff ... :;):

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