Tactical Command
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/

New to EA :- rules questions .
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=28888		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  eye of the maelstrom [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:33 am ]
Post subject:  New to EA :- rules questions .
So please be gentle if I sound a bit stupid as I have only played 2 games so far and just need some clarifications.

So I DO understand that only by taking an engage action would allow you to enter an assault and use FF or CC but if you have entered an assault and unit is not in base contact but still within 15cm , would modifiers used when normally shooting for example -1 because the enemy is in cover be used eg FF 4+ becomes FF 5+?

I will probably have more questions as I play more but will add them to this thread.

thanks
Author:  MephistonAG [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
No modifiers to FF, the -1 to hit is only applied to ranged shooting (so AP/AT/MW)
Author:  eye of the maelstrom [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 11:39 am ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
thanks for clearing that up so quickly !
Author:  jimmyzimms [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
Though defender cover saves do count in assaults
Author:  mordoten [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 4:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
Welcome to the great game of Epic!
Author:  Blip [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 4:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
jimmyzimms wrote:
Though defender cover saves do count in assaults


Though only if you don't counter charge ;-) Again, welcome to the (pernickety) world of EA!
Author:  SpeakerToMachines [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 5:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
Blip wrote:
jimmyzimms wrote:
Though defender cover saves do count in assaults


Though only if you don't counter charge ;-) Again, welcome to the (pernickety) world of EA!


If you're still in cover terrain after the countercharge, don't you still get cover saves? That's how we've always played it...
Author:  MikeT [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 5:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
I believe cover save still applies if the counter charger is within cover at the end of the countercharge.
Author:  Kyrt [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
Blip wrote:
jimmyzimms wrote:
Though defender cover saves do count in assaults


Though only if you don't counter charge ;-) Again, welcome to the (pernickety) world of EA!

I'm not sure the rules say that exactly. Here's the relevant section:

Rulebook 1.12.5 wrote:
Roll 1D6 for each unit that may attack. Note that Blast markers do not suppress units from formations involved in an assault – it is assumed that the proximity of the enemy means that everyone joins in! Compare the dice roll to the unit’s close combat value if it’s in contact with the enemy, or its firefight value if it’s within 15cm of the enemy but not in base contact. If the dice roll is equal to or greater than the relevant value, then a hit is scored on the enemy. No modifiers ever apply to these dice rolls.

Each player allocates the hits and make saving throws in the same manner as they would when allocating hits from shooting. Hits may only be allocated to units that were directly engaged in the combat (i.e., that belonged to the attacking or defending formation and which were within 15cms of the enemy after charge and counter-charge moves were completed). Infantry units from formations taking a charge action may not take cover saves (they are assumed to have left cover to charge the enemy), but other infantry units may take cover saves normally.


I guess it depends on your definition of "taking a charge action". Sadly the rulebook is full of such poor uses of terminology - the action used for assaults is not "charge" but "engage", which might lead you to interpret this to mean a charge move, and yet counter-charging is not an "action".
Author:  kyussinchains [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
if you look at the FAQ it states the following:

Q: Do the Cover Save and Cover to-hit modifier apply in Assaults?

A: Defenders in an Assault get the Cover save from any terrain they are in but attackers never get a Cover Save from terrain. The -1 to-hit modifier is not applied as there are never any modifiers to attack rolls in Assaults.

I think that's pretty clear cut, defenders get cover saves regardless of whether they countercharge or not, providing they are still in the terrain at the end of the countercharge move
Author:  Blip [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 6:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
Oops, my bad ! :-)
Author:  kyussinchains [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:16 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
weirdly when I look at my self-printed copy of the rulebook, that section quoted by Kyrt has the phrase 'units taking an engage action'

I can't be certain but I think my copy was the most recent one before GW pulled it from their site, incorporating all the errata....
Author:  Kyrt [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:26 pm ]
Post subject:  New to EA :- rules questions .
Now that is indeed strange, I copy pasted that from the updated rulebook. Mine is dated Oct 2009, does yours have a date? If you still have the PDF of course.
Author:  Apocolocyntosis [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 9:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
PDF text i have is engage action as well. PDF title (*not* file title) is: Epic_Arm_008-033 , created 04/02/2004
Author:  MephistonAG [ Mon Jan 19, 2015 10:14 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: New to EA :- rules questions .
Quick way to know is look at the 1.7.5 transport rules. If it talks about Inf getting a 6+ save you have the version Hena updated and got GW to host post 2008 review, If not they you have the original version from the printed book.
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