Suppression rules question |
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iblisdrax
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Post subject: Suppression rules question  Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 1:36 am |
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I don't understand the logic of suppressing only the units that are capable of shooting with blast markers. Why, if the whold formation being shot at, wouldnt ALL the units in the formation be suseptable to suppressing fire?
my 1 question,
iblisdrax
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mr_mich
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 1:45 am |
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Because then you get people supressing units like reloading manticores, which seems kind of unfair because they're getting around the negative effects of the blastmarker by sacrificing shots they couldn't take anyway.
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Markconz
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 3:53 am |
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| Quote (mr_mich @ 26 2004 Feb.,00:45) | | Because then you get people supressing units like reloading manticores, which seems kind of unfair because they're getting around the negative effects of the blastmarker by sacrificing shots they couldn't take anyway. |
Actually you can count the manticores as supressed, quotiing Jervis:
"Q: Are slow-firing units that fired in the previous turn are eligible for supression even if they are unable to fire this turn?
A: Yes.
Best regards,
Jervis Johnson
Head Fanatic"
http://forums.specialist-games.com/epic40k....ID=1152
and in another thread:
"They *can* count for suppression. All you need is to be in range and have a LOS - actually being able to shoot is not a requirement."
and he continues...
"With hindsight it might have been better not to change the supression rules, which originally allowed you to suppress *any* unit, even those that were not in range or LOF. We changed the rule to stop players having units that they hid out or sight but could use to soak up BM, but the change has ended up throwing more problems than it solves IMO. Definately something to disucss in the first rules review."
http://forums.specialist-games.com/epic40k....ID=1393
In good old Epic40k you could choose which units in your detachments were supressed... looks like we might be going back to that system.
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CyberShadow
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Thu Feb 26, 2004 11:55 am |
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The supression rules do seem to be getting more and more complicated. I would prefer it if all formations were sinply supressed from the back, not counting units that were not allowed to fire for any reason - such as reloading, out of range, etc.
I dont think that we will go back to a choice of supression of units, as this would cause commanders to put the weak troops at the frint to both be destroyed and supressed. The original system allowed destroyed from the front and supressed from the back to give the best units to place to hide, and this seems a fine system to me.
I am still confused about the single Hydra being supressed against aircraft. It is supressed if nothing else is in range, but not if there are even some AP shots in range of the incoming bomber...? 
_________________ https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond. https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
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iblisdrax
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 12:21 am |
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Well, my group will probably stick with the E40k style system of suppression, because it is simpler to use. Having to figure out which units can fire, then which ones are suppressed is a pain, IMHO.
my 2cents,
iblisdrax
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Legion 4
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Fri Feb 27, 2004 5:46 am |
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Always do what works for you ! I don't really like the way E:A uses mix dets, either. We never intended to play E:A "by the book", only take what we like and add it to our "Hybrid" rules. And as I said we have been using activation since SM1 in '90. And we normally don't use mixed dets, except with Grunts in transports, of course. So my point always is - if you don't like it - fix it ! 
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dafrca
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 5:37 pm |
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I must admit to being a scale snob. 
I do not like to own the same models that are of different scales. I do not mind a slight shift from "type to type" but I do not like to have two Baneblades, one of the FW and the other of the original metal. Either I want both one or the other.
Anyway, before I buy Valkyries from either source, does anyone have both that could take a few shots to show how different they realy are in size? This could make a differance for me.
Thanks
dafrca
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primarch
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 9:11 pm |
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Hi!
Dafrca, I ordered all the remaining FW stuff, so give it a few weeks until it arrives and I will give you comparative photos.
Primarch
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penal battalion
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 10:22 pm |
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I agree on the scale thing, it makes both of them look wrong. Thats why I've stuck with ordering large no's of FW valkryies and will only get a few metal if they are very close scale.
Heres to snobbery 
Cheers and a Pimms.
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dafrca
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 10:31 pm |
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| Quote (primarch @ 14 2004 May,13:11) | Hi!
Dafrca, I ordered all the remaining FW stuff, so give it a few weeks until it arrives and I will give you comparative photos.
Primarch |
Thanks Primarch. I can wait, it's not like I do not have tons to paint already, between Epic and my 15mm Sci-Fi forces. 
dafrca
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dafrca
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Fri May 14, 2004 10:52 pm |
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| Quote (penal battalion @ 14 2004 May,14:22) | | I agree on the scale thing, it makes both of them look wrong. |
I started to see this back when I first started my 1/285th scale modern collection. I bought HUMVEEs or M113 variants from more then one company. Then when you placed them on the table I had a HUMVEE bigger then one of the M113s and the M113s where three different sizes. Made it look odd. 
Later on I saw the same thing with my friends 15mm WWII vehicles. Shermans from different sources were not the same scale. Very odd.
So I have tried to stick to one company for most stuff. In the case of Forge World and GW, even though they seem to be the same company in ownership, they seem to have the same issues. Models not the same scale. I look at the Wolfhounds, shape differances aside, and they were different in size. Same for all the super heavies.
Anyway, I am ranting, so I will stop.
dafrca
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MaksimSmelchak
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Sat May 15, 2004 3:25 am |
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Dafrca,
I know what you mean, but I still like variety. I've found that I just keep all the pieces of one type to a unit that the disparities aren't so bad.
Take care and Shalom,
Maksim-Smelchak.
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dafrca
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Sat May 15, 2004 4:37 am |
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| Quote (primarch @ 14 2004 May,20:03) | Hi!
If there is one thing I have learned regarding epic over the years is that you dont sweat the scale.
Its never been consistent, never has, never will. As long as the individual model looks good and I have fun using it, thats all that really matters..... ?
Primarch |
I do not have an issue with scale overall from Epic. What I do not want is to have two Rhinos next to each other and have one clearly larger then the other. Or to have my company of three baneblades with two much smaller then the third.
I do not mind that the Rhino, the marine, and the Thunderhawk are each slightly different scale. That is not big deal to me.
dafrca
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penal battalion
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Post subject: Suppression rules question Posted: Sat May 15, 2004 8:21 am |
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Agree on the scale in the same force situation. As long as they are in diffrent formations or armies its okay. Or if no one points it out on the battle field, it's a sure fire way of me targeting it with irrational amounts of weapons.
The M113 are a very good example especialy in 10mm/ 1/200th scale, gets confusing! 
Cheers.
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