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Big formations or more activations?

Pariah Press

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 8:56 am

Brood Brother

Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:42 am
Posts: 253

Alas, I have no razorbacks, nor predators!

Okay, how's this revised marine list look?

Embers of Doom Space Marines

6 Tactical Units + transports
Supreme Commander Upgrade
400

6 Tactical Units + transports 300

5 Land Speeders 200

4 Devastators + transports
+2 Land Raiders
+1 Dreadnought
500

4 Devastators + transports
+2 Land Raiders
450

4 Assault Units 175

5 Bikes 200

4 Scout Units + transports 150

4 Terminator Units 325

TOTAL 2675

Could this give the Guard army (above) a run for it's money? And vice versa?

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-Ethan

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nealhunt

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 1:50 pm

Purestrain

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm
Posts: 9617
Location: Nashville, TN, USA

I think that looks a lot better. The only thing I see is this formation is a problem: 4 Devastators + transports
+2 Land Raiders
+1 Dreadnought
500

You have transport, but the Dreadnought will slow down the formation to 15cm anyway. I understand that you need to both add some points and make only one BTS formation but something should be shuffled here. Possibly add a Librarian to one of the Devastators instead? Or drop the LRs and Dread (leave one Dev formation in Rhinos) and replace them with another Bike, Speeder, or Assault formation and a character (225 or 250 points).

Also, if you end up with 25 points to spare, you might as well give the Scouts the Sniper upgrade.

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Neal

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Evil and Chaos

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 2:00 pm

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Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire

(Hena @ Aug. 24 2007,06:27)

QUOTE

I would change one LR formation to Predator Annihilators. Those can be nasty against vehicles.

Advising a newbie to use predators is just sadistic.

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Evil and Chaos

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 2:04 pm

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Joined: Fri May 05, 2006 2:57 am
Posts: 20887
Location: Harrogate, Yorkshire

Against IG artillery they'd be KO'd before they got to fire.

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Pariah Press

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Fri Aug 24, 2007 5:51 pm

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Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:42 am
Posts: 253

(nealhunt @ Aug. 24 2007,13:50)

QUOTE

I think that looks a lot better. The only thing I see is this formation is a problem: 4 Devastators + transports
+2 Land Raiders
+1 Dreadnought
500

I'll ditch the dreadnought for a Librarian, then. Sounds good. Thanks for the help, friends!

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-Ethan

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Pariah Press

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:49 am

Brood Brother

Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:42 am
Posts: 253

Och! I just finished the game, and I got stomped, hard! My friend played the IG, and I played the marines.

I tried to get in close with the macro weapons, but he kept his infantry companies close to the war engine formations, so he could provide supporting fire with the infantry. There wasn't enough cover on the table, I think, so I couldn't just avoid the war engines, either. I think that if I'd coordinated my forces better, I could have used the Supreme Commander to launch a massed assault, but I just couldn't get my ducks in a row at the right time. My opponent, however, made excellent use of combined arms, with the infantry and the war engines supporting each other admirably.

By the end of the game, I had two Land Raiders and a Bike unit left, neither of which were holding any objectives. I didn't manage to kill anything important (just a few models here and there, and one of the Basilisk batteries).

Next time (if I can convince anyone to play with me again!) I will use my mobility more, even if it means sacrificing some firepower. Or just play a different army!

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-Ethan

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nealhunt

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 2:39 pm

Purestrain

Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm
Posts: 9617
Location: Nashville, TN, USA

The way to counter a tight "castle" formation is to chip away at it with clipping assaults.

Stall and use your long range formations as much as possible, then use the SM activation advantage to set up assaults with a lot of support. Keep in mind that with your Strategy Rating 3 higher than the IG, you can count on setting something up at the end of one turn and getting to act first at the beginning of the next turn.

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Ekranoplan

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 4:45 pm

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Joined: Fri Dec 02, 2005 7:58 pm
Posts: 9

(Pariah Press @ Aug. 21 2007,02:58)

QUOTE

Well, I've been into Epic since 2nd edition. ?I just never made the jump out of second edition. ?We're going to play 2600 points (just enough for a Warlord Titan to fit). ?

?I don't have any Ork models, and prefer not to proxy, so the training missions are out. ?I think I have a pretty good handle on the rules after reading through the book twice. ?Also, this is one of the very few chances I'll have to play, so I want to play a "real game."

The training missions are mostly marine vs. marine, and the first few basic training missions are all marine vs. marine. I think the only one that features orks is the War Engine training, and maybe the aircraft training.

They really are great missions, and they go by fast so you could easily do some of the missions and play an actual game.

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Pariah Press

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 6:08 pm

Brood Brother

Joined: Fri Oct 24, 2003 2:42 am
Posts: 253

(Hena @ Aug. 27 2007,11:58)

QUOTE

Edit: How did you and your friend like it though?

I can see why people prefer the ruleset to 40K's, or even NetEpic's. Things like supporting fire, the ability to move 90 cm in a turn, the lovely blast marker mechanic add so much depth to the game. I thought it was much more interesting and challenging than 40K (which I've been playing a lot of lately) but it was frustrating to start losing from turn 1 and keep losing for the rest of the game.

I don't think my friend really liked it, though. He felt that the models didn't have much personality (though he liked the Warhound Titans) and the inevitably slow pace (because we had to look up every rule, practically) was a bit wearing on him. He did enjoy taking me down a peg, though!

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Dwarf Supreme

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 6:19 pm

Brood Brother

Joined: Fri May 20, 2005 8:45 pm
Posts: 11148
Location: Canton, CT, USA

(Pariah Press @ Aug. 27 2007,13:08)

QUOTE

I don't think my friend really liked it, though. ?He felt that the models didn't have much personality (though he liked the Warhound Titans) and the inevitably slow pace (because we had to look up every rule, practically) was a bit wearing on him. ?He did enjoy taking me down a peg, though! ?

Looking up rules is part of the learning process. Don't get discouraged. Like any other game, when you become more familiar with the rules and spend less time consulting the rulebook, the pace of the game increases.

As for minis having personality, I guess that's a matter of opinion. I happen to like pretty much all of the Epic minis.

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Ginger

Post subject: Big formations or more activations?

Posted: Mon Aug 27, 2007 9:06 pm

Brood Brother

Joined: Wed Nov 16, 2005 7:20 pm
Posts: 5483
Location: London, UK

One thing you noted (and many tend to ignore at their peril) is the need for an adequate covering of terrain to hide in. There should be two pieces per 2' x 2' section, or 12 pieces on the usual 6' x 4' table. Furthermore this should represent something like a 30% covering! Removing Line of Sight (LOS) and providing cover (-1 to hit) gives foot sloggers much better chances for survival. Equally, touching your Armoured Vehicles does the same thing.

Another pointer is to watch opposing activations and move into areas they cover after they have activated - they cannot activate twice and with your superior strategy rating, you should be able to mount an attack early the next bound. So avoid a head-on assault by attacking one side / flank or the other. Use March manoeuves to switch formations from the left hand side to the right to concentrate against your desired targets. Prep the enemy with some shooting to place a BM or two and get support formations into position before assaults.

Air adds another dimension, but the tactics are essentially similar - get into positions that he cannot retailate against, try to preserve your formations as long as possible, attack in strength with the assault resolution calculations in mind - and don't forget it takes two hackdown hits to kill each Marine (because of the "They Shall Know No Fear" rule)

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