Tactical Command
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Windrider host composition
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=14791		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Cranium27 [ Sat Feb 07, 2009 12:58 am ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
My first post after re-discovering these boards (and I must say refreshing not to worry about the GW police making your post dissapear because it 'reflects badly' on them). Anyhows nothing contentious....


I have trawled through the search engine, viewed battle reports and force compositions and just wondered how people prefer to make up their windrider host composition. Seems most go for the 4 jetbikes / 2 vypers option for the BM ability, but what about other mixes and how would you use them differently?

I ask as I am currently basing up 6 hosts, variety of models is not an issue.

Thank you in advance for your comments.
Author:  Ginger [ Sat Feb 07, 2009 2:18 am ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
I nearly always use 5x Windrider and only 1x Vyper.

This maximises the assault capabilities and resilience while allowing the formation to lay a BM for shooting. I regard any hit as a bonus because it is not really likely.

The point is that the formation works best as a rapid support to an assault. So double across the battlefield and lay a BM, followed by the assault from some other formation. If that other formation is also some bikes (note they engage at 50cm), they can consolidate on to the next target to support another assault by a third formation, effectively using both bike formations twice.
Author:  Cranium27 [ Sun Feb 08, 2009 10:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
So the 4 jetbike + 2 vyper set-up or is a more cautious approach giving you BM ability at range with reduced possibility they fall prey to casualties / suppression. Is there a role for 6 x Jetbike or a 6 x Vyper selection?
Author:  Soren [ Sun Feb 08, 2009 10:40 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
i would go for 5-1 or 4-2...mostly chosen how  because of many Jetbikes you can afford on Ebay ;)
Author:  Irondeath [ Sun Feb 08, 2009 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
4 Jetbikers, 2 Vypers for me, like the redundancy, the better save and the ability to shoot with 1 BM.
Author:  Ginger [ Mon Feb 09, 2009 1:20 am ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
Quote: (Cranium27 @ 08 Feb. 2009, 21:13 )

So the 4 jetbike + 2 vyper set-up or is a more cautious approach giving you BM ability at range with reduced possibility they fall prey to casualties / suppression. Is there a role for 6 x Jetbike or a 6 x Vyper selection?

First point to question is whether you are playing the rules + 2008 amendments, or using the additional suggestions incorporated in the 'Handbook' (which give the Jetbikes a 5+ save). Second question is how you intend to use the formation.

I use the 2008 amendments only, so the Jetbikes and Vyper all have a 4+ save - thus the formation composition depends on how I want to use it. As I said earlier, the Vyper is only there to be able to place a 'Shooting BM' in preparation for an assault by another formation. As such I want to maximise on the support potential and the Vyper is not as good as the Jetbikes in this respect. Irondeath's point on redundancy is that being the only Vehicle in the formation, the Vyper becomes the automatic target for any AT shooting and consequently likely to die quickly. The answer here (as for all Eldar formations) is to keep hidden until needed to avoid being shot at.

As to an all-Jetbike or all-Vyper formation, being a LV means that the Vypers can be shot at by everyone and are consequently more vulnerable than the Jetbikes. However, being infantry makes the All-Jetbike formation slightly less vulnerable and means that is almost as usefull as a mixed one.
Author:  Cranium27 [ Mon Feb 09, 2009 1:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
So would you go for a first formation 5 jetbikes and 1 vyper and using the tactics described by many to place BM and put in FF support of a second assault formation. Should you go for the second assault formation as all jetbikes to maximise potency (and reduce AT vulnerability) - or would you rate the balance of 2 formationsof 5 + 1 better as it keeps your opponent guessing where you will strike.

Overall I am getting the feeling that no-one uses 3 + 3, there is some benefits to a 6 jetbikers unit, and most people use either a 5+1 or 4+2 combination.

I have now got 21 stands of jetbikes assembled, many more to do (I am a sad modeller and am taking the flash lines off!)and 6 vypers and getting the sense that for morphability I may be best painting up my hosts as 6 Jetbikes + 2 Vypers to allow me to use any combination of 6, 5/1, 4/2. Possibly with the addition of a couple of Vyper only hosts (although I am less convinved about the effectiveness of these due to their AT & AP vulnerability).

Thank you all for your comments so far.
Author:  Mephiston [ Mon Feb 09, 2009 2:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
When I was using them I ran them pure. But in my recent eldar lists I've not been using any at all.
Author:  Ginger [ Mon Feb 09, 2009 2:50 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
Quote: (Cranium27 @ 09 Feb. 2009, 12:50 )

So would you go for a first formation 5 jetbikes and 1 vyper and using the tactics described by many to place BM and put in FF support of a second assault formation. Should you go for the second assault formation as all jetbikes to maximise potency (and reduce AT vulnerability) - or would you rate the balance of 2 formationsof 5 + 1 better as it keeps your opponent guessing where you will strike.

Personally I would keep at least '1' Vyper in each formation for flexibility. Without any Vypers, the Jetbikes become pure assault troops, though you could indeed consider 4+2 a safer bet.

Eldar tend to excel at the principle of appearing weak where they are strong, appearing dispersed while able to concentrate strength where it is needed; in effect, being masters of deception. So personally I would not have any 'pure' Jetbike formations to keep the opponent guessing where the blow will fall.
Author:  nealhunt [ Mon Feb 09, 2009 3:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
Around here it's straight jetbikes - assault, assault, assault.  Leave the BM placement for other formations.
Author:  Chroma [ Mon Feb 09, 2009 3:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
I think it all really depends on whether you're playing Epic-with-2009-errata or the Epic-with-NetERC-recommendations.

The reduction in the save value for Jetbikes has me usually putting two Vypers in a Troupe, as "forward shields" in addition to their shooting.
Author:  Cranium27 [ Sat Mar 07, 2009 7:45 am ]
Post subject:  Windrider host composition
Thanks again for all your comments. I have now assembled 4 windrider hosts of 6 jetbikes and 2 Vypers and a further formation of 6 jetbikes... onto other elements in the army... and at some point painting them.
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