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Eldar 'Armour'
CyberShadow	Post subject: Eldar 'Armour' Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 1:58 pm
Swarm Tyrant Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm Posts: 9338 Location: Singapore	I have long been puzzled by the Eldar background (probably one of the least consistant out there). In particular, in the current list, the use of the Falcon. I simply cannot see how these 'elite' transport vehicles would be used as standard armour in a Falcon Troupe. Using the transport tanks in this way just doesnt fit the specialist theme. Therefore, I am looking to expand my Craftworld list. Falcons are still available as a transport option, but the Falcon Troupe is replaced by the following: Warhawk Type: Armoured Vehicle Speed: 35cm Armour: 5+ CC: 6+ FF: 4+ Bright Lance : 30cm : AT5+ : Lance Shuriken Cannon : 30cm : AP5+ Skimmer These are fairly light tanks, and I am pitching them at about 150-200 points for four or five. Comments? _________________ https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond. https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
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nealhunt	Post subject: Eldar 'Armour' Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 3:11 pm
Purestrain Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm Posts: 9617 Location: Nashville, TN, USA	I've never seen Falcons as especially elite.  What background do you think gives that feel? _________________ Neal
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CyberShadow	Post subject: Eldar 'Armour' Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 3:14 pm
Swarm Tyrant Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm Posts: 9338 Location: Singapore	Sorry, perhaps 'elite' is the wrong word. What I mean is that this unit is turning into a 'jack of all trades', and is fairly expensive because of it - want transport, get a Falcon, want AT fire, get a Falcon, want a blitz tank, get a Falcon... I would just like to see a dedicated AT tank in my Eldar list (and a use for the old wedge Falcons). _________________ https://www.cybershadow.ninja - A brief look into my twisted world, including wargames and beyond. https://www.net-armageddon.org - The official NetEA (Epic Armageddon) site and resource.
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semajnollissor	Post subject: Eldar 'Armour' Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 5:26 pm
Brood Brother Joined: Mon Dec 26, 2005 6:38 pm Posts: 1673 Location: Chattanooga, TN, USA	Well, I don't think that an Eldar player actually pays any points for the Falcons' transport capacity when he takes a Falcon Troupe. The points only "work" in GT scenarios, and in those scenarios the Falcons in Troupes can't use their capacity. Also, Falcons (and other guardian-based units) aren't supposed to be specialized, they are the generalists in contrast to the Aspect warrior's and (now) the EoV's specialist-ness. That said, I wouldn't have a problem with having a more specialized vehicle, but I'm not sure your suggestion would be all that attractive. Even at 150pts for 5, I think 5 Falcons for 100pts more would be a better deal, since they have more range, hit on a better roll, and typically get more shots. On the other hand, if the cost of your formation went any cheaper, it would risk being taken more for cheap activations than for any other reason. I will also add that the Eldar don't really need another AT platform, they need a better AP tank. The Firestorm is okay, but it's AA ability means having too many is abusive. I'd like a firestorm-esque tank without the AA ability. Replace that bright lance of yours with a pulsed-scatter laser dealie and you'll be in business.
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nealhunt	Post subject: Eldar 'Armour' Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 5:32 pm
Purestrain Joined: Thu Feb 13, 2003 10:52 pm Posts: 9617 Location: Nashville, TN, USA	Semaj!  Good to hear from you again.  Fancy a game any time soon?  I suspect the 13th will be a game night at the Pitts' place. _________________ Neal
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CyberShadow

Post subject: Eldar 'Armour' Posted: Fri Jan 06, 2006 6:22 pm

Swarm Tyrant Joined: Thu Jan 02, 2003 6:22 pm Posts: 9338 Location: Singapore

Well, I don't think that an Eldar player actually pays any points for the Falcons' transport capacity when he takes a Falcon Troupe. The points only "work" in GT scenarios, and in those scenarios the Falcons in Troupes can't use their capacity. Looking at it again, and you are correct. The Falcons are 15 points cheaper when purchased as a Troupe with no infantry. However, there is still the background issue. Also, Falcons (and other guardian-based units) aren't supposed to be specialized, they are the generalists in contrast to the Aspect warrior's and (now) the EoV's specialist-ness.

It is true that Guardians are not as specialised as Aspect Warriors, but the Eldar tanks are a different matter. The other vehicles have clearly defined roles, and the Eldar are the only race (as far as I can remember) which bundle their transports up and point them towards the enemy on hunter missions. It is not just that they are general-purpose, but that they are more general than similar units from other races. It just feels wrong.

Perhaps the suggestion is a little weak. My initial idea was:
45cm/AT4+/Lance
15cm/AP5+/Pulse

...using the vehicle as fire support.

I will also add that the Eldar don't really need another AT platform, they need a better AP tank. The Firestorm is okay, but it's AA ability means having too many is abusive. I'd like a firestorm-esque tank without the AA ability. Replace that bright lance of yours with a pulsed-scatter laser dealie and you'll be in business.

Are you sure about this? The Wraithlord is the only Eldar AV unit which doesnt have an AP weapon on it. You seem to be approaching this from the flip side that I am. I looked at the Fire Prism and wondered if this was really the best AT platform that the Eldar would field.