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Tau in 40K

 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 5:27 pm 
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Apparently, the Tau also appear in other scales and game systems! I know, I was shocked too!

Anyway, I understand that many of you here are 40K Tau players, and I would like to get an idea of some sample lists that you use in the game. So, if you could post your 40K Tau lists in this thread (I would like to keep this restricted to this thread), with a short set of notes about what various squads are designed to do on the battlefield then that would be interesting.

I have posted my first 40K Tau Empire list here.

Thanks.

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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:15 pm 
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Whats 40K? :p


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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 7:45 pm 
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Bah! What your want is to play Tau in all game systems. 40k may be the new crazy fad, but spend time looking about and you'll also find yourself with a Commerce Protection Fleet, an Exploration and Commerce Fleet, a couple of Por'la for Inquisitor and maybe, just maybe, rules for a Crisis suit in Necromunda  :p

Dunno about that list, but on initial glance it looks okay.

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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 10:37 pm 
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My pre-new codex list looked like:

3 x Hammerheads, all SMS, 2 x Railguns, 1 x Ion cannon
- Upgrades included the decoy launcher, disrupt pod, upgrade to fire all weapons after moving 12"

3-4 x 12 Firewarriors squads, Devilfish, same upgrades as HH, also add upgrade to get to BS4

2 x Crisis with Plasma rifle + Missile pack

1 x Shas'o Assassin w/TL Fusion gun + Shield Generator

1 x Shas'o w/TL Missile Packs + Shield Generator

The only thing I plan on changing with the new codex is adding SMS to all my Devilfish.

Basically, I take out big stuff with my Hammerheads and maneuver with my DF until I can shoot my opponent into bloody rags.

Rapid Fire and I are close friends.   :/

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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 11:19 pm 
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My regular opponent brings:
Shas'el, TL Plasma, Missiles, Multitracker, Target array (I think)
2x Fireknife Crisis, Target array
2x 12 Fire Warriors in a Devilfish, multitracker, decoy launchers
2 Broadsides w/ slow and purposeful, 2 Shield Drones
1 Hammerhead (rail, obviously), multitracker and decoy launchers
3x 3 Sniper Drones

It comes to around 1000 points, if I haven't forgotten anything.  Essentially, everything just stays back and shoots, forcing the enemy to come to them.  Crisis Suits can move-shoot-move, and the Sniper Drones can't be seen from far away.  When things get close, the Fish move in and unload their Fire Warriors.

I'm not exactly sure whether you're asking just out of curiosity or whether you're looking for what people think is effective in 40k.  If it's concerning effectiveness (and you're also wondering how your list would stack up in a competitive environment), I have a few points concerning your list.

First, your HQ shouldn't have drones or a bodyguard.  The Independent Character rules prevent him from being fired upon if he isn't the closest target to the enemy, and that's not hard to do with something as mobile as a Crisis Suit.  For this reason, you may want to reconsider the short-range Fusion gun on the 'El, too.

Flamers and Burst Cannons are generally frowned upon on Suits.  If you're close enough to flame the enemy, you're almost certainly close enough to get charged or shot up.  Keep in mind that a flamer template's range is only 2" longer than a Marine's charge range - faster things like 'nids and Eldar, or just Assault Marines, can catch you rather easily.  Burst Cannons aren't any more impressive than 3 Fire Warriors, and are much more expensive.  The Tau list suffers from a lack of heavy weapons in Fire Warrior squads - your Crisis Suits are the only things you can efficiently bring S6 and S7 weaponry on, and wasting the opportunity is something that shouldn't be done lightly.  Most people prefer the Fireknife or Deathrain configurations - one is Plasma, Missiles, and a multitracker, while the other is TL missiles and something else.

Being 'heavy', the Markerlight on your Stealth Suit team leader can't be fired on the move, making it a tremendous handicap.  Stealths themselves, though, are often considered an amazing selection, and many players take 2 full squads.

Fire Warriors are always nice, though most consider a squad with some Carbines and some Rifles a bad pick - popular opinion seems to favor Rifles in Devilfish with the occasional all-Carbine squad on foot (these haven't quite caught on yet, though).  Bonding is generally regarded as a waste of points as well.

Disruption pods aren't going to do a thing for the Piranhas - they have to get close to do anything, and enemy anti-tank weapons generally have a 48" range.

Consider making the Broadside a team leader and giving him shield drones - they make him very hard to take down with the new rules.

I can always edit this out if this isn't the sort of thing you wanted in the thread, of course.






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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Wed Apr 05, 2006 11:46 pm 
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I'll continue to take minimum FW for Troop choices. They are disposable. They will walk (squints at Honda! :alien:)

Elites = stealth and crisis with FireKnife (Multi-tracker, Plasma Rifle, Missile Pod) - can you say "staple?" ...but I may waste the points to upgrade to a Shas'vre (Sergent) on my mona's so I can give them a +1 to hit as well... since the new crisis got cheaper. We'll see.

When it comes to Fast Attack, if the FW products are legal in the tourny, Tetras are a given in 40K - especially with the current ML rules - OMG, can't wait! New MarkerLights, railrifles and Devilfish with SMS are too enticing not to explore - Hello pathfinders! I'll be taking the new PF's to see if I can get them to work in my hybrid lists. (in days of old, the PF's didn't work in 40K tourny lists - just fun games due to points efficiency issues) The markers are just so uber sweet now. The fall back here will be 8-man drone squadrons of course - but only if needed. Cheap deep striking and mass fire is always of value.

2x Shas'o commanders with Fireknife are still no brainer for HQ. Shield drones look tempting now, but probably aren't necessary unless you are planning on going out hunting forward. Just not necessary in most cases... so we'll see.

Kroot and vespids are still to the curb in most games. :/

Rail-heads with SMS are always a fav for 2 Heavy Support choices, but the broadsides ith movement are a must have to explore now. SMS and Twin-rail for me all day long there. The new Sniper Drone unit is also interesting gear. I'm going to have to explore these for points efficiency. I can see 2-3 units being very handy. Its the stealth field that's the icing on the cake for me. Like the stealth, these are going to be a great formation to draw the enemy out with. However, unlike the stealth - they have 36" range - huge! You have to enter that range if you want to see them to fire at them... and when you do roll, you only get 2D6x3 in inches. Better get pretty close, or roll box cars. The rail rifles here plus in the Pathfinders - who needs FW? FW will become bait - just like the used too - in the Hybrid lists anyway.

Honda, glad you didn't let me down. Viva la FoF :p

... LOL (side joke),

Cheers,

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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 6:25 am 
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So what do people arm the FW and pathfinders with?

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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 1:50 pm 
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Honda, glad you didn't let me down. Viva la FoF


And I in turn keep hoping you'll finally get it.  :/

@TRC

What people arm their PF's with is something that will evolve over time with the new codex.

Prior, people either took two units, one with rail rifles one with all PC/ML and leveraged the ML hits with the other tools.

Now that the ML has additional capabilities, you will see the above fielding of PF's, 2 x the ML version to take advantage of Alpha Strike possibilities using the Skyray as well as enhancing Hammerhead shots.

However, in spite of their enhancements, in 40K it will be extremely difficult to keep them alive for very long as their capabilities will become even more well known and every Tom, Dick, Susie, and Harry will be assaulting them as quickly as possible. Given 40K game mechanics, a Pathfinder that survives past Turn 4 will be a very lucky fellow.

So, in light of all that hoopla, I think you'll see the Mech faction "date" the pathfinders for awhile, but they'll never marry. Too many points sunk in a short return unit. In my case, I don't really see them breaking into the varsity line up.

The Hybrids and Foot heavy may use them more, but in reduced roles.

Now, the one thing that would change my mind on this is if the physical restraints of playing on a 4' x 6' board were lifted and there was more room to maneuver. Then some of the PF's mobility could be taken advantage of. Also, if the DF wasn't a requirement, then I would also entertain adding them into the mix.

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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2006 4:08 pm 
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Quote (The_Real_Chris @ 06 April 2006 (00:25))
So what do people arm the FW and pathfinders with?

@TRC,

My response is going to be focused on top players and Tau veterens. If you want to know what the common tourny player took (that wasn't a vet or top player), just pick up the old codex - all options were taken in general.

However, if you want to talk about Top veteren Tourny Tau players - from the old codex perspective,

HISTORICALLY SPEAKING:

HYBRID LIST - FW in the Tournament Scene
6-man units of Pulse Rifles. 1 shot at 30" forces the enemy to advance on you as no other main/basic weapon had that kind of range. FW forced the enemy to approach. And when they did, two shots at 12" is a beautiful thing - FW would move 6" forward and then fire 12" to give them an effective 18" range and simply douse the enemy with fire. If the enemy lived through all that, remenants would charge and wipe out the 6-man squad well enough - no worries, the FW did their job, rest of army would mop up remenants. When you are packing the most powerful (Strength 5) basic infantry weapon in the game. And 10 points a model - who can complain!

MECH TAU LIST - FW in the Tournament Scene
12-man units of Pulse Rifles riding in a DF. This is called Fish o' Fury (FoF) by the Tau mech heads. 1 shot at 30" was used if the DF got popped early, but that's contingency planning for the FoF fans... the tactic and goal was to bus the FW in and use the DF as a shield. Dump 2 sets of 12 FW in 12" range of the intended target for a massive total of 48 S5 shots into the enemy, and to say that it was a withering hail of fire was an understatement. 48 shots = 24 hits S5 hits.

Vs a Toughness 4 target (marines, chaos, etc) that meant 24 chances to wound on 3+ or 16 wounds! With 3+ power armor save, that would yield 5 wounds on average - so the typical min/max marine squad would be dead.

Vs a Toughness 3 target (Tau, Eldar, DE, IG, many bugs, etc) that meant 24 chances to wound on 2+ or 20 wounds. As the Pulse Rifle is AP5 in 40K, it means you need at least a 4+ armor save in order to save... so typically, only Tau and some Eldar could save vs. these 20 wounds. The others just died.

INFANTRY LIST - FW in the Tournament Scene
Having more points to spare, these guys would take sergents and larger model counts in squads of FW on foot. The Shas'ui (sergents) would take a Marker Light as well as 2 drones. Note: a sergent could be taken regardless of whether you are playing hybrid, mech, or all infantry... but 10 point guy + 10 point serg upgrade, +10 point for ML + 7 more points for a target lock to get this guy to be able to fire at a seperate target meant he was getting really expensive. So it was common to only see a ML on a Shas'ui in all infantry lists.

HYBRID, MECH, or INFANTRY LIST - FW in the NON-Tourny Scene
You would see all kinds... bonded units, photon gernades on every model, sergents with drones and Markerlights, half of every unit had Pulse Carbines... etc. Sometimes they would take all the upgrades, but not all the models - then put them in a DF.

+ + + PATHFINDERS TO FOLLOW + + +

HYBRID LIST - Pathfinders (PF) in the Tournament Scene
Didn't really exist due to mandatory DF

MECH LIST - PF in the Tournament Scene
Most justified in this list, but the old ML wasn't enough value to justify the points sync of models. The old ML was a heavy weapon so you couldn't move and fire. That meant the unit came with a DF, but wasn't really as mobile as the Mech list wanted to be - therefore, a waste of points in the end.

INFANTRY LIST - PF in the Tournament Scene
Mandatory DF purchase caused these guys to steer clear of the PF

HYBRID, MECH, and INFANTRY LIST - PF in the NON-Tourny Scene
When it comes to ideology, larger than tourny standard and in general - fun games - Pathfinders are a Tau favorite. (I have 2 units of 8 that I own for just that purpose, both have 3 rail rifles in them)

The Pathfinders are chocked full of upgrades and goodies. They get scout and are forward reconissence, so always started on the field - regardless of what the mission special rules said. So did their Devilfish. They didn't have to deploy in the DF and they got a free basic move before the game started - so commonly, you place the models in the DF to start take your free move and deploy into cover somewhere. Railrifles were a MUST on this unit and some would take 4-man units, others would take 8-man units.

The 3x rail rifles were a staple if you were fielding PF's. Each one of the Rail Rifles may take the Target Lock which allows each model to target a different enemy unit. The S6 AP3 weapon was just too good in an army where the non-suit infantry really don't get heavy weapons beyond a marker light. The rest of the unit could only take pulse carbines and markerlights. Well, the sergent could buy wargear and take a pulse rifle I believe, but I never seen that. The unit would mark things up and fire their Marine killing S6 AP3 weapons at any power armor target they could find. Should a tank expose a side or rear - it would be targeted by these 36" range weapons. Even the strongest infantry transports (chimeras) FRONT ARMOR was not safe against these weapons It was a regular thing to see PF's popping ork transports, IG chimeras, Eldar wave serpents, Marine rhinos any and all dreadnoughts, choas defilers, vindicators, basalisks, etc. PF's were the only non-suit infantry that could actually threaten the front armor of a lot of vehicles in the 40K game. The markerlights were essential when you wanted to increse the "to hit" chance of another model's weapon in the army. 40K marks used to work differently than they do in EA.

Heh, now they are really going to work differently...

As far as how FW and PF are going to be used by top vets now, well, see my previous post. I noted how I was going to experiment with them. The pulse carbine remains a worthless weapon though IMHO.

Cheers,





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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 6:23 pm 
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Good to see that I'm not the only one who would try to rope you into BFG and Inquisitor as a means of furthering the Greater Good!

Once you go Kor'vattra, you never go back (only across, to ther Specialist Games!)


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 Post subject: Tau in 40K
PostPosted: Fri Apr 07, 2006 6:58 pm 
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My normal Tau list before the new Codex

Shas'o: PR, MP, Shied gen, HW Multi-tracker
Etheral

2x (2)Crisis Suits: (1) Team Leader w/ TL PR, MP, HW Multi-tracker, (1) TL PR, target lock

(1) Crisis Suit: TL MP, Drone Controller w/ 2 gun drones

2x 12 FW w/ Shas'ui
9 FW w/ Shas'ui
6 FW w/ Shas'ui w/ HW drone controller and two gun drones
6 FW w/ Shas'ui w/ HW drone controller and two gun drones; plus Devilfish

(3) Broadsides: (1) TL Rail Gun, SMS, Target Lock, (1) TL Rail Gun, SMS, Drone Controller w/ two Shield Drones, (1) Team Leader, TL Rail Gun, SMS, Target Lock, HW Drone Controller w/ 2 Shield Drones

2x Hammerheads: Rail Gun, (2) burst cannons

I like this list because it has good firepower and decent mobility. This is 1850 points.

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