Tactical Command
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Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=23&t=5452		 Page 1 of 2
Author:  CyberShadow [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 12:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Just three quick questions about the armoured units of thel list.

1. An Armoured Cadre consists of six Hammerheads, each either Ion Cannon or Railgun. Which kind of mix do you field? Personally, I have boosted my forces and two of my Armoured Cadres will start with 4xRC/2xIC and 5xRC/1xIC formations.

2. What mini do people use for the Stingray?

3. Do you use the collectors stats for the missile-armed Hammerhead?

My thoughts here are that we dont currently have a mini for the Stingray, most people seem to use the missile pack Hammerhead, and it is unlikely that FW will produce a third missile armed Hammerhead variant (after the missile Hammerhead and Skyray). I am tempted to cut the missile pack Hammerhead from the collectors model section and just use the mini as a Stingray...
Author:  blackhorizon [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 12:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Quote (CyberShadow @ 22 Nov. 2005 (11:24))
I am tempted to cut the missile pack Hammerhead from the collectors model section and just use the mini as a Stingray...

Curious, what are collector models about? I don't fully understand? Noob me. :oops:
Author:  CyberShadow [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 12:36 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
In other lists, the collectors models represent the stats for units where the models are no longer available, such as the Ork Lungbursta or Chaos Jugger riders. In the Tau force, the collectors models section is where we put the stats for units that do (or may) have models but which dont necessarily add anything to the game - in this case there are a number of alternative weapon fit options for the Hammerhead available as models, but little actual difference in stats or battlefield role.
Author:  blackhorizon [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 12:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Aaah, okay thanks!!
Author:  Steele [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 12:51 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
1) I fielded all possible combinations, but the most used basic Cadre will be 4 Rail and 2 IC. Boosted by at least 1 Swordfish and a Skyray.

2) At the moment I proxy them with Devilfish, but will use the Missile HH from Forgeworld.

3) Don?t use them, other formations cover them better.

Cheers!
Steele
Author:  asaura [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 1:09 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Haven't had a chance to field the Armored Cadre, yet.

1. 5RG+1IC is a bit of a no-brainer. You get the range and AT power of RG, and you get the large but lousy flak coverage of the single IC. I don't like the IC Hammerhead concept at all and only use them as single "flak fields".

2. I use the missile pack Hammerhead (have 8 of them).

3. Couldn't care less.
Author:  Dobbsy [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 1:21 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
1. 6xRC & 6xIC HH - though I plan to change this up at some stage

2. I'll be using the missile pack Hammerhead - quick and easy to figure out what it is on the table

3. No. Don't plan to either.
Author:  Honda [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 2:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre

1. An Armoured Cadre consists of six Hammerheads, each either Ion Cannon or Railgun. Which kind of mix do you field? Personally, I have boosted my forces and two of my Armoured Cadres will start with 4xRC/2xIC and 5xRC/1xIC formations.


I have been fielding mine as all one type or another, so 6 x RG or 6 x IC. I used to use mixed types (e.g. 4 x RG, 2 x IC), but found in a couple of games that the RG range left two IC shots stranded. So, I don't do that anymore.

Since then, the fit for purpose formations can get into the right range for the right target and not leave any shots on the table.

My big armored cadre is 6 x RG + 2 x SrF


2. What mini do people use for the Stingray?


I'm using the Skyray to cover both Swordfish and Stingrays. I paint the tips of the seeker missiles different colors to represent the different vehicle types.


3. Do you use the collectors stats for the missile-armed Hammerhead?


No.


My thoughts here are that we dont currently have a mini for the Stingray, most people seem to use the missile pack Hammerhead, and it is unlikely that FW will produce a third missile armed Hammerhead variant (after the missile Hammerhead and Skyray). I am tempted to cut the missile pack Hammerhead from the collectors model section and just use the mini as a Stingray...


That'd be fine by me.
Author:  Nerroth [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 4:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Having (finally!) recieved my Missile Hammerheads, I will use four of them as Stingrays - and one of the other two as a Hammerhead addon to my Russ company. (I'll count it as an Ion Cannon Hammerhead, as currently suggested in the Collector's section - I'll have to paint it to look distinct from the Stingrays!)


Gary
Author:  Tactica [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 5:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Quote (CyberShadow @ 22 Nov. 2005 (11:24))

1. An Armoured Cadre consists of six Hammerheads, each either Ion Cannon or Railgun. Which kind of mix do you field? Personally, I have boosted my forces and two of my Armoured Cadres will start with 4xRC/2xIC and 5xRC/1xIC formations.


If I know which army I'm facing and the player, I will customize the cadre to one of these:
=======================================
6R
5R/1IC
4R/2IC
1Sf/4R/1IC
1Sf/3R/2IC
2Sf/4R
2Sf/3R/1IC
2Sf/2R/2IC

If I'm going in without knowing what I'm playing against, I'll go with one of these - but points depend upon the Sf...
4R/2IC
1Sf/3R/2IC
2Sf/2R/2IC

With the Skyray additional hunter missle changes, I will also be kicking around the following when I have the spare 75 points:
5R/1IC/1SkR
6R/1SkR

2. What mini do people use for the Stingray?
Alternate Missile Pod HH from FW.

3. Do you use the collectors stats for the missile-armed Hammerhead?
No - just like in 40K, the stats for all the alternates are worthless.

My thoughts here are that we dont currently have a mini for the Stingray, most people seem to use the missile pack Hammerhead, and it is unlikely that FW will produce a third missile armed Hammerhead variant (after the missile Hammerhead and Skyray). I am tempted to cut the missile pack Hammerhead from the collectors model section and just use the mini as a Stingray...
I think you only making official what we all already do... :)However, as much as I like the idea - I fear we tread on dangerous waters here.

Forgeworld has named this unit in their IA3 at 40K scale and even on their website in the epic section and 40K section. If we try to officially 'rename' it as Stingray but use their model, they may take offense... They've already named it "EPIC TAU HAMMERHEADS WITH DUAL MISSILE POD TURRET" (sorry for caps, that's just a cut and paste)

Now, could we call it "Dual Missle Pod Hammerhead" codename: Stingray - then we could probably get away with using their model but with our stats...  :devil: hmm...

[Digression Mode]
** Personally, I would like to see the IC a little better than the railcannon on AP but keeping the AA since the thing has 60cm range... i.e. AP3+/AT4+/AA6+. This would help it distinguish itself a bit.

Like Asaura, I take it for AA screen historically as it doesn't kill infantry any better than the Railhead, and its better than paying 75points for the historically not worth it Skyray.

Now that the skyray has 2 huntermissle shots being playtested in the WIP list - I'm hoping that's more worth it for the AA and 75 point investment.

The uptick of +1 for AP on the ion-cannon would help distingquish it from the Railhead without losing the fact that its a MBT by keeping the 4+AT.
[/Digression Mode]

Cheers,
Author:  nealhunt [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 5:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
1)  I have my first Tau game scheduled for this weekend (YAY! :laugh: ) and I plan on fielding 6xIC in order to create a decent AA field in which to operate close air support.

2&3)  All proxies, but the missile pod HH seems reasonable as a Stingray and I agree the collector's models are for scenario play only.
Author:  Tactica [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 8:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Quote (nealhunt @ 22 Nov. 2005 (16:46))
1) ?I have my first Tau game scheduled for this weekend (YAY! :laugh: ) and I plan on fielding 6xIC in order to create a decent AA field in which to operate close air support.

2&3) ?All proxies, but the missile pod HH seems reasonable as a Stingray and I agree the collector's models are for scenario play only.

Hey, congrats NH. Did you pick up models, proxy, or borrowing? I remember you saying something about coming into a Tau army in the near future.

Batrep?

I'll be interested to hear how the all IC formations go. You and honda and I guess steele(or was that dobbsy...) all mention making use of full IC. I've not had luck with those.

Good luck,
Author:  nealhunt [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Oh, it's all proxy - every piece.

One of my regular opponents has been waffling about actually buying the FW models.  He recently bought the Epic Cathedral and it arrived damaged.  As it is discontinued, they offered him credit.  I'm trying to talk him into taking the plunge.
Author:  tneva82 [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 9:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
Quote (nealhunt @ 22 Nov. 2005 (20:10))
Oh, it's all proxy - every piece.

One of my regular opponents has been waffling about actually buying the FW models.  He recently bought the Epic Cathedral and it arrived damaged.  As it is discontinued, they offered him credit.  I'm trying to talk him into taking the plunge.

That's weird. My orders have been arriving without any damage so far...Very odd.

Hopefully he isn't too discouraged by that. In general FW service is excelent in my experience(now if I only had credit card so could order them myself and not rely on rare occasions somebody I know orders from FW...)
Author:  Tactica [ Tue Nov 22, 2005 11:57 pm ]
Post subject:  Stingray and the Armoured Cadre
NH,

I see. Well, the models are pretty sweet. I think the infantry in general are a bit fragile. Personal opinion. There's some great looking epic:A tau online by one of my friends this week though - its a red paint scheme. He had 10K points (maybe a bit more) and is realizing that he just doesn't need it all - LOL. So you might be able to get a good start that way

tneva,

I agree. I've generally had great luck with FW in the past years. Early on, they had some issues, but they tend to be dead on in the recent past. I've had no parts or pieces issues that they didn't immediately rectify. I do a fair amount of business with them, but still, typically - no real issue they don't address straight away from email.

Cheers,
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