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Army List: Chaos
MagnusIlluminus
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:05 am 
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scream wrote:
MagnusIlluminus wrote:
On the same note, all of the other Centuries (World Eaters, Death Guard, Emperor's Children) each have BP of 8, when it should probably be 9. Each of their constituent detachments have BP's of 3 out of 5 models, so the total should be 9 for the Company.

If this was done intentionally, let me know. Admittedly, a BP of 8 would be just over half of the 15 models in the Company, while 9 is a bit higher yet. Still, since these Companies do not have any Command models, perhaps their BP should be 9.

For that matter, was it intentional to remove the Chaos Champion that was a part of these Companies back in 2nd edition? I'd love to hear the reason(s) behind that.


Break Point for a company card is not the sum of each detachment break point but the sum of stands /2 (rounded up).


Yeah, generally so. There are a few Factions that have exceptions to this (most notably Squats, and Tau to a lesser extent) but in general you are correct.

I guess then the World Eaters, Death Guard, & Emperor's Children BP should not change, but the Thousand Sons Century has to. Automations do not break. It's a part of their special rules. But somehow when part of the Century, do now do. This makes no sense. Really, the Break Point entry for the TS Century should be: 5+6 and the VP: 4+2, with the note that the second value for each is specifically for the Automations. In this way, this Century would behave like the Squat Ironbreaker Company, where the Leviathan has it's own BP & VP, even though it is purchased as a part of a single formation.

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:08 am 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
scream wrote:
MagnusIlluminus wrote:
On the same note, all of the other Centuries (World Eaters, Death Guard, Emperor's Children) each have BP of 8, when it should probably be 9. Each of their constituent detachments have BP's of 3 out of 5 models, so the total should be 9 for the Company.

If this was done intentionally, let me know. Admittedly, a BP of 8 would be just over half of the 15 models in the Company, while 9 is a bit higher yet. Still, since these Companies do not have any Command models, perhaps their BP should be 9.

For that matter, was it intentional to remove the Chaos Champion that was a part of these Companies back in 2nd edition? I'd love to hear the reason(s) behind that.


Break Point for a company card is not the sum of each detachment break point but the sum of stands /2 (rounded up).


Yeah, generally so. There are a few Factions that have exceptions to this (most notably Squats, and Tau to a lesser extent) but in general you are correct.

I guess then the World Eaters, Death Guard, & Emperor's Children BP should not change, but the Thousand Sons Century has to. Automations do not break. It's a part of their special rules. But somehow when part of the Century, do now do. This makes no sense. Really, the Break Point entry for the TS Century should be: 5+6 and the VP: 4+2, with the note that the second value for each is specifically for the Automations. In this way, this Century would behave like the Squat Ironbreaker Company, where the Leviathan has it's own BP & VP, even though it is purchased as a part of a single formation.


Hi!

Thinking that is a mistake. It means the break point should be modified and the VP as well.

Should I errata it with your suggested values?

Primarch

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MagnusIlluminus
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:27 am 
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I would suggest doing so. If anyone objects, and can present a good reason, we can always remove the errata note later.

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Wed Jun 25, 2014 2:41 am 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
I would suggest doing so. If anyone objects, and can present a good reason, we can always remove the errata note later.


Hi!

Duly added to the gold summary errata page. :)

Primarch

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MagnusIlluminus
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:11 am 
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Just found another typo. The description of the Shambler (page 14) does not specify what Template it uses for it's Toxic Breath attack. For the moment, I'm going to assume that it uses the Small Teardrop template.

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Wed Sep 10, 2014 3:49 am 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
Just found another typo. The description of the Shambler (page 14) does not specify what Template it uses for it's Toxic Breath attack. For the moment, I'm going to assume that it uses the Small Teardrop template.


Hi!

I believe you are correct.

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MagnusIlluminus
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 5:52 am 
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primarch wrote:
Hi!

I've never had much of a problem with the Banelord as written (I tend to use it when I play chaos).

... Now that it doesn't have the reactor vulnerability in the front template, it should do quite well.

Primarch


This was not changed for the errata version of the Chaos.pdf. Any reason why? Also Bubonis and Skylok still have Front arc Reactor locations. Shouldn't these have been replaced with Leg as the Imperial Warlords were?

Also, the Lord of Battles' hit location template is heavily messed up.
_ Front Arc, middle row, center location was Body in 2nd/TL era, why is it Weapon now?
_ Front Arc, bottom row, outer locations should both be Wheel. Currently one is Wheel and one is Weapon.
_ Side Arc, bottom row, 'front' location should be Wheel, not Weapon. The weapons do not hang that far down.
_ Rear Arc, bottom row, outer locations should be Wheel, not Weapon.

For evaluating cost for the revised method for hit locations, I am adjusting the locations as above, as that is what makes sense based on the model.

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 3:07 pm 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
primarch wrote:
Hi!

I've never had much of a problem with the Banelord as written (I tend to use it when I play chaos).

... Now that it doesn't have the reactor vulnerability in the front template, it should do quite well.

Primarch


This was not changed for the errata version of the Chaos.pdf. Any reason why? Also Bubonis and Skylok still have Front arc Reactor locations. Shouldn't these have been replaced with Leg as the Imperial Warlords were?

Also, the Lord of Battles' hit location template is heavily messed up.
_ Front Arc, middle row, center location was Body in 2nd/TL era, why is it Weapon now?
_ Front Arc, bottom row, outer locations should both be Wheel. Currently one is Wheel and one is Weapon.
_ Side Arc, bottom row, 'front' location should be Wheel, not Weapon. The weapons do not hang that far down.
_ Rear Arc, bottom row, outer locations should be Wheel, not Weapon.

For evaluating cost for the revised method for hit locations, I am adjusting the locations as above, as that is what makes sense based on the model.


Hi!

Omission on my part. :-[

One more then for the next update.

I haven't noticed the mistakes on the LOB template until you pointed them out. I would make formula calculations based on your outlines above.

Primarch

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MagnusIlluminus
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 6:42 pm 
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I have noticed that the Chaos Titans' Reactor is a bit more resistant to damage (the damage chart is different) than the Imperial version, so perhaps it should stay on the Front arc. Opinions on this?

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Fri Jul 03, 2015 8:11 pm 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
I have noticed that the Chaos Titans' Reactor is a bit more resistant to damage (the damage chart is different) than the Imperial version, so perhaps it should stay on the Front arc. Opinions on this?


Hi!

I'd still remove it from the front arc. No matter how favorable a damage chart may be, the ease of targeting it and hit it outweighs any benefit in that regard.

This may make chaos titans slightly more powerful than Imperial equivalents, but that is both in accordance with "fluff" and also can be given a higher cost in regards to the formula.

Primarch

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MagnusIlluminus
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 3:48 am 
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Yeah, that's reasonable. I'll adjust the hit locations in my calculations.

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 1:12 pm 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
Yeah, that's reasonable. I'll adjust the hit locations in my calculations.


Hi!

Should I wait or begin updating my cost comparisons document now?

Also, I will now only include gold and current formula costs, since I no longer think it is necessary to list the last two formula costs.

Primarch

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MagnusIlluminus
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:10 am 
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Definitely wait. So far, only the values for Imperial Titans and Praetorians have been posted, and even then I recently found a slight error in the Imperial Reactor location value. Thus that has changed. I'll post that at some point.

I see no reason to update the file for the hit locations changes until they are all posted.

Though if you want to update it to V0.33 that would be fine.

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 3:16 pm 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
Definitely wait. So far, only the values for Imperial Titans and Praetorians have been posted, and even then I recently found a slight error in the Imperial Reactor location value. Thus that has changed. I'll post that at some point.

I see no reason to update the file for the hit locations changes until they are all posted.

Though if you want to update it to V0.33 that would be fine.


Hi!

I will update to V0.33 and only list Gold versus that version (the most current) going forward. :)

Primarch

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primarch
 Post subject: Re: Army List: Chaos
PostPosted: Wed Jul 08, 2015 11:56 pm 
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Hi!

Chaos book updated.

Primarch

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