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What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?

 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 3:21 am 
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Hi!

Aircraft Orders

We need to define a set or "actual" flier orders that make sense to what they can do and achieve in the context of the rules. GW never really gave this thought and forcing the standard orders on them has created issues.

Aircraft in general do one of several things:

1. Strafe/Bomb runs
2. Dogfight
3. Landing Zone insertion/extractions ("Hot LZ")

Any other functions?

How should each functions be defined?

Also once these are defined, AA needs to be defined on how they act according to the standard orders.

Primarch

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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 4:28 am 
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primarch wrote:
We need to define a set or "actual" flier orders that make sense to what they can do and achieve in the context of the rules. GW never really gave this thought and forcing the standard orders on them has created issues.

Aircraft in general do one of several things:

1. Strafe/Bomb runs
2. Dogfight
3. Landing Zone insertion/extractions ("Hot LZ")

Great idea. I heartily approve.

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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 5:25 am 
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If we want to make the "Repair" order more attractive, it could allow one damaged location to be automatically repaired, no roll needed. Each location after the first that needs to be repaired is slightly less likely, the second needing a 2+ (on 1d6), the third needing 3+, etc. The sixth and any subsequent locations would repair at 6+. The owner of the model chooses what order to repair things in. This includes Shields, at one Shield per position.

As a clarification on Repair, how would the order affect the model's ability to fight in Close Combat? Obviously it cannot start one, but if it gets charged that turn it should probably be nearly defenseless.


On Aircraft, I have no ideas specifically about orders, but I had an odd thought to make AA more relevant. What if an AA model caused the area it can fire into to be considered as Difficult Terrain for Flyers & Floaters? This would make players have to be more careful where they moved such models.

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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:40 am 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
On Aircraft, I have no ideas specifically about orders, but I had an odd thought to make AA more relevant. What if an AA model caused the area it can fire into to be considered as Difficult Terrain for Flyers & Floaters? This would make players have to be more careful where they moved such models.


Interesting idea, some sort of template system, or just something like an immediate difficult terrain test (not that we have such a thing at the moment), or just have a rule were the AA units never actually fire or roll to hit and just say, any fliers moving within range of this unit is treated as travelling through difficult terrain. So basically once they are plonked on the table, they automatically cover an area until destroyed.

Another thought that popped into my head regarding AA is maybe we should have two different types! Normally you have either rapidly firing "bofor" type guns which just fill an area of sky with bullets in the hope of catching a flier and you also have sophisticated one shot targeted missiles, which just home in a hit. So maybe allow some types of AA units to shoot with a barrage template?


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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 4:21 pm 
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Primarch that close combat system look cracking I think you need to find a way to explain the part about the pile in at the top as that sounds very complex and I wasn't sure I understood it.

Also a proposal for Space Marines and Chaos Space Marines is the tactical mastery rule they get in 40k which basically means after that first round of combat they can choose to leave without the morale check :)

PS: When I was talking about the voluntary withdrawal I always intended for the first round to be fought although hit and run units should get the option to leave before combat :)


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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:42 pm 
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MagnusIlluminus wrote:
If we want to make the "Repair" order more attractive, it could allow one damaged location to be automatically repaired, no roll needed. Each location after the first that needs to be repaired is slightly less likely, the second needing a 2+ (on 1d6), the third needing 3+, etc. The sixth and any subsequent locations would repair at 6+. The owner of the model chooses what order to repair things in. This includes Shields, at one Shield per position.

As a clarification on Repair, how would the order affect the model's ability to fight in Close Combat? Obviously it cannot start one, but if it gets charged that turn it should probably be nearly defenseless.


On Aircraft, I have no ideas specifically about orders, but I had an odd thought to make AA more relevant. What if an AA model caused the area it can fire into to be considered as Difficult Terrain for Flyers & Floaters? This would make players have to be more careful where they moved such models.


Hi!

I love this idea! :)

First repair/shield regen auto-successful and each additional one as you mention with increased repair target number.

This makes the order SO WORTH IT! SOLD! ;D

As for close combat, it would be "defenseless". Roll 2d6 with no CAF bonus. If the element on repair orders happens to win close combat, it does not inflict damage on enemy, but breaks off combat. If it loses the attacker rolls 3d6 and drops the lowest die for the total score for damage (I am already assuming 2d6 damage tables in this rule).

If we used the proposed rules for close combat, it "withdraws" up to its charge move. I would impose no further penalties for withdrawing since surviving a round of close combat with no CAF bonus and increased probability for damage sufficient drawback.

Primarch

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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 9:56 pm 
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Mattman wrote:
MagnusIlluminus wrote:
On Aircraft, I have no ideas specifically about orders, but I had an odd thought to make AA more relevant. What if an AA model caused the area it can fire into to be considered as Difficult Terrain for Flyers & Floaters? This would make players have to be more careful where they moved such models.


Interesting idea, some sort of template system, or just something like an immediate difficult terrain test (not that we have such a thing at the moment), or just have a rule were the AA units never actually fire or roll to hit and just say, any fliers moving within range of this unit is treated as travelling through difficult terrain. So basically once they are plonked on the table, they automatically cover an area until destroyed.

Another thought that popped into my head regarding AA is maybe we should have two different types! Normally you have either rapidly firing "bofor" type guns which just fill an area of sky with bullets in the hope of catching a flier and you also have sophisticated one shot targeted missiles, which just home in a hit. So maybe allow some types of AA units to shoot with a barrage template?


Hi!

Magnus's "difficult" terrain idea is very creative! I don't think anyone has ever thought of that one! :)

Fliers have very large movements, so this "interdiction zone" can make things quite hairy for them by eating up movement. That is a good passive deterrent that does not require overly complex rules.

As far as I can theorize it solves some of the more overpowering issues of fliers, which is its ability to strike deep into the opponents half of the table to bomb/strafe or land troops. Since fliers start off table, on an average 4 foot wide tabletop (around 120-125cms) that would mean reaching mid table takes around 60cm of flier movement.

While all fliers can achieve that easily on the first round of flier deployment, penetrating deeper will be unlikely in the first turn. Interdiction zones would chop down the remaining 40cm (assuming the flier moves 100cm) to just 20cm. Insufficient to reach valuable targets deep in the opponents table half.

Fliers with 75cm movement (most bombers) will be incapable of reaching the opponents half at all with such a rule.

Transports will HAVE to be escorted. They'll never make it to favorable drop sights on the first few turns due to interdiction.

Magnus's idea has sparks a viable flier system which I will layout on a separate post. :)

Primarch

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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 10:02 pm 
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deanmon wrote:
Primarch that close combat system look cracking I think you need to find a way to explain the part about the pile in at the top as that sounds very complex and I wasn't sure I understood it.

Also a proposal for Space Marines and Chaos Space Marines is the tactical mastery rule they get in 40k which basically means after that first round of combat they can choose to leave without the morale check :)

PS: When I was talking about the voluntary withdrawal I always intended for the first round to be fought although hit and run units should get the option to leave before combat :)


Hi!

The first part was a suggestion to address the part of avoiding the "fiddlyness" of the current system of measuring each element to see whether or not it has enough movement to engage in close combat.

Instead, if for example you have a formation of lets say 8 elements and 5 of them have enough movement (remember MORE than HALF the formations total number) to engage in close combat, then ALL 8 can be placed in base to base contact with eligible elements from the target formation.

This way you avoid having to measure for each and every one as it is now. If equal to or less than half the formations number can make it, then only those that actually have enough movement to reach base to base contact may do so.

Is this clearer?

Primarch

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 Post subject: Re: What changes/improvements would you like to see in NEP?
PostPosted: Fri Jul 18, 2014 10:45 pm 
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Yeah I think so it just was very complicated :)


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