Tactical Command
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Rolling to save units
http://www.tacticalwargames.net/taccmd/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=26981		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  The Bissler [ Sun Feb 23, 2014 6:40 am ]
Post subject:  Rolling to save units
I have always played the game that if a unit's save is modified to between 7 and 9, you would still roll any armour rolls as normal, but looking to roll a 6 and then between another 4 or 6, depending on what the number you are trying to roll is. If the save required is 10+, the model is instantly destroyed and removed from the board.

But I've just spotted this in the NE Gold rules:

"Example: A Terminator has a 4+ Armour Save and a 6+ Fixed Armour Save. It is hit by a bolter (TSM 0) so the player must roll a 4+ to save. If it is hit by a volcano cannon (TSM -4) the regular save becomes 7+ and therefore impossible, so the player must roll the 6+ Fixed Save to survive."

So it seems like I have been playing the game wrongly and any time the required saving roll exceeds 6+, the unit is automatically destroyed!

Has anyone else been playing this in the same way I have?
Author:  _stu_ [ Sun Feb 23, 2014 11:34 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
We've played almost exactly the same way, assuming that there is always a chance (however small) of surviving a hit. Looking at the original space marine rule book, it describes the roll to hit (modified by cover) just after the saving throw section. I think this is where we picked up the interpretation that anything modified to 7+ and beyond would require a natural 6 and then a subsequent 4+ or more. I do remember occasions where 6 then 6 then 4 were rolled. Always at crucial times in the game as well. We always put it down to the limitations of a d6 system.

Not sure whether to change, as it does give quite tense cinematic moments where units can fight on beyond all normal odds.....
Author:  The Bissler [ Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:02 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
Yep, I feel pretty much the same way Stu! I think my interpretation of the rules probably came from the same place as you, or even 1st edition 40K.

On reflection, I'd rather have that small chance of a save rather than none at all. Like you say, it doesn't happen often but when one such save comes off, it can be a major moment in the game. Usually both players can't believe the roll but having differing feelings of elation or despair depending on which side of the roll they were on. These little moments provide some of the best drama and fun in the game and provide talking points when everything is being cleared away after the battle.

So yeah... Whether or not it is out of step with the rules, I think I'll be sticking with this! ;D
Author:  Irisado [ Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
It is out of step with the rules though, just to confirm. You cannot take a save (unless it's invulnerable) if it is totally negated by the firing weapon. This was also the case in SM2.

It's up to you how you play it, but I just wanted to make this clear for the benefit of any new/newer players who may read this.
Author:  The Bissler [ Sun Feb 23, 2014 1:29 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
That's fair enough. I could also add that as another counter argument against how I've been playing is that play should be sped up if you have insta-death circumstances rather than rolling for unlikely rolls. But can't see myself changing how I play! Just another example of house rules!
Author:  Mattman [ Sun Feb 23, 2014 10:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
I have always played that to hit rolls can go to 7+ etc, but not saves.
Author:  The Bissler [ Sun Feb 23, 2014 10:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
Because you play it correctly Matt! ;)
Author:  primarch [ Mon Feb 24, 2014 2:42 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
Hi!

I could see doing it that way (and may have in some point in the past). The chances of doing it are smaller, but possible. It adds to the tension of the game.

From a strict rules perspective its not the way it was originally intended, but fun is fun. ;)

Primarch
Author:  ForgottenLore [ Mon Feb 24, 2014 4:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
My only concern with mechanics like that are that they slow the game down, but it is a perfectly viable way to lessen the problems inherent in the low resolution of a D6 mechanic.

(is it just me, or does that sentence come across as really pretentious?)
Author:  primarch [ Mon Feb 24, 2014 5:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
ForgottenLore wrote:
My only concern with mechanics like that are that they slow the game down, but it is a perfectly viable way to lessen the problems inherent in the low resolution of a D6 mechanic.

(is it just me, or does that sentence come across as really pretentious?)


Hi!

It may slow it down, but perhaps not terribly so.

I would prefer a d10 based epic game, but if the d6 is still desired, a multi-d6 mechanic would be welcome.

Primarch
Author:  _stu_ [ Mon Feb 24, 2014 9:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
Multi d6 is how we handled things in larger games, rolling two different d6 but nominating one as the ’first’. Only if that came up a 6 did the result of the 2nd die come in to play. It kept things fairly fluid, and as long as you had dice of more than one colour it was pretty easy to implement.
Author:  The Bissler [ Mon Feb 24, 2014 10:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
Stacks of differently coloured dice are simply a must. For example, quite often I'll split fire for the likes of a squad of Land Raiders - 6 dice, declaring "2 red dice at the Guardians, 3 at that Tempest, one at the Avatar." Speeds play up immensely.
Author:  primarch [ Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:00 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Rolling to save units
The Bissler wrote:
Stacks of differently coloured dice are simply a must. For example, quite often I'll split fire for the likes of a squad of Land Raiders - 6 dice, declaring "2 red dice at the Guardians, 3 at that Tempest, one at the Avatar." Speeds play up immensely.


Hi!

I've never actually used this, but yes, its a great idea that would save time.

Hey, guys remember to comment on the "great formula debate thread!". ;)

Primarch
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