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Ork Issues & SHT questions

 Post subject: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 8:07 am 
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Hi,

during my 2 last games vs Orks, my opponent and me discussed about few issues about Orks:

- Gibbletgrinda & Skullhamma armor: it's an ancestral choice but we wondered why the skullhamma has an "All around armor" but not the Gibbletgranda ? When you look at the minis, you fastly see that the skullhamma has far less armor plates (and the boiler is visible) and with the weight gained with few armor, it gains the "triple move on charge". But the Gibbletgrinda has a huge integral armor plate everywhere but no all around armor ? I checked my old "Orks & Squats Warlords" book and the skullhamma was all-around armor. Would not it be time for correcting this ? IMHO, GG should be all around armor and SH not.

- Few years ago there has been a discussion about "Superheavy table" that should only work for Imperial SH tanks (does not work on Eldar SHGT etc...). So where is it useful to have some superheavy fliers if SH table can not be used on them ? As Fliers are not pinnable, I do not see where SuperHeavy Class can be used for them. Maybe I'm wrong and the SHT table works for all Superheavies in the game.

- About bombers: HellTalon is just too expensive to be played. Just check Marauders Destroyers Bombers profile & cost and it appears that HellTalon can't support comparison. Maybe 2 Helltalon @ 350 points (or event @400) be a better choice. It's sad to have a beautiful (and available) mini but that's not played because it costs too much for what it can do.
On the same, we have the Ork Blasta Bomma: fantastic mini (with 3 different patterns on FW catalogue) but 500 points for 1...This hurts...


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Mon Oct 04, 2010 11:50 pm 
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Superheavy table applies to all superheavies in the game unless otherwise specifically noted in the description of the individual model.

Aircraft are expensive. If anything the Imperial stuff should go up in price. The Blasta Bomma is a flying titan....500 is probably expensive but it is still a cool thing to play, and Orks get plenty of bargains anyway.


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 7:47 am 
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zap123 wrote:
Superheavy table applies to all superheavies in the game unless otherwise specifically noted in the description of the individual model.


Sorry, my fault! I extended the no SH Table for nids ;)

zap123 wrote:
Aircraft are expensive. If anything the Imperial stuff should go up in price. The Blasta Bomma is a flying titan....500 is probably expensive but it is still a cool thing to play, and Orks get plenty of bargains anyway.

Aircraft are expensive, that's true and I think they became even better with the rule "shoot the thin part". When shooting at a titan, Fighta-bommas cannons become TSM -3, this hurts. And Blasta Bommas cannons become -4...Maybe the "shoot the thin part" rule may be rebalanced at some point. Picking aircraft in a list is somewhat an hard choice. Against IG with 1 or 2 dets of hydras, you know your planes won't last long but against orks or marines with their short AA range you'll be able to generate lot of casualtys with fliers. On another side, Orks can pick some terrible "AA" units like magna-cannon, DeathSkulls Shootas (auto-hit), Shock Attack Guns, Weirdboy tower...).

About the blasta bomma, yes, it's a kind of flying titan but as you mentionned, Orks have lots of bargains on others units so picking a blasta bomma is just for pleasure, not because it's a valuable unit ;)

And what about All Around armor on Giblet Grinda instead of Skull-Hammas ?


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Tue Oct 05, 2010 11:44 pm 
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I've only used the BBomma once, but it was surprisingly effective. Maybe it didn't fully pay for itself but must have gone pretty close, virtually single handedly rolling up a flank and surviving to the end of the battle. It was against Chaos though.

I do remember thinking way back that they really got the GG and SH mixed up, but I can't really see the need to change them now. I think you could switch more stats around and make them both super effective (Triple charge and all around armour on the GG would be awesome! Then give the Skullhammer the 5 shots @ 75cm) but I think they are already good value, and that's not really what the Orks are about.


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 5:52 am 
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My idea was not to swap all stats, just to place the all-around armor on the right miniature, the one that looks having more armor than the other.It's like if the stormhammer had stats with a single volcano cannon and shadowsword had stats with multiple battle cannons ;)
"Strange, stats do not seem to be done for the mini :/"


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 4:29 pm 
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Quote:
shoot the thin part

In my last games I totally forgot to use this rule
But I agree it is a powerful one
What about using"shooting" on the thin part only while on high level
and normal targeting rules for low level


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Wed Oct 06, 2010 5:11 pm 
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ulric wrote:
What about using"shooting" on the thin part only while on high level
and normal targeting rules for low level


This how I already play the "Shoot the thin part" ability but I do not remember last time when my fliers when at low altitude (except Thunderhawk landing ;))...But the Sttp rule with a squat overlord is really powerful 6*5+/-3 @75cm + 4*5+/-1 + 6*6+/-1...


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 07, 2010 1:04 am 
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ulric wrote:
Quote:
shoot the thin part

In my last games I totally forgot to use this rule
But I agree it is a powerful one
What about using"shooting" on the thin part only while on high level
and normal targeting rules for low level


Yup, this is how the alternate flyer rules are worded.


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Fri Oct 08, 2010 6:29 am 
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Quote:
Yup, this is how the alternate flyer rules are worded.

uuups that is where my idea is from :-X


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Tue Oct 12, 2010 2:43 pm 
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Just checked something in the ork codex:

Warboss card consist of 1 warboss, 5 nobz & 2 battlewagons, 8 minis and BP is stated 5, should not it be 4 as Warboss card with 3 stompas is stated BP 6 (for 11 minis) ?


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2010 12:05 am 
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Indeed it should...sounds like a typo.


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 14, 2010 5:02 am 
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Thanks for your reply Zap, I was not sure it was a typo (maybe something about "only get VP by killink the warboss stand"), should I post this typo in NetEpic Errata thread ?


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Mon Oct 25, 2010 12:24 am 
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Yes, please do.


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Wed Oct 27, 2010 2:48 pm 
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Another thing that may be a typo: FlakkWagon are noted "Mekboy card" in support card in Gold Codex, not in 5.2 Codex.


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 Post subject: Re: Ork Issues & SHT questions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 28, 2010 2:52 am 
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Yup, that should also be errated. We stopped them being Mekboy as they should be readily available (and aren't very good :D ).


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