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Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
Juffo-Wup
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Tue Mar 24, 2009 1:11 am 
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Quote: (zap123 @ 24 Mar. 2009, 00:02 )

Quote: (Warhead @ 23 Mar. 2009, 19:08 )

Is/was there any difference between a Fire Control Tower and a Fire Control Platform?.. I think I have both.

Nah, different model, same effect.  Platform seems to have been relatively rare...I've never seen one in the flesh, but I've seen toooo many towers  :tongue:

:vD

Yes you have, zap.  My Wolf Lords Warlord Titan has one.  Right next to the Plasma Destructor.  I'll take a pic tonight when I find it (I packed it away recently as I cleaned up my gaming room).

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Malleus
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 7:13 pm 
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Next topic!

400* Exarch
150 Swooping hawks

seems a realy good combo to pick off enemy HQ units, letting the swoops screen the exarches giving them some cover...
But how effective is it to be able to sniper of the HQ units of enemy armies? does it have any profound impact on any army? Im guessing IG and Ork with to little nobs in it might be affected?
Or is it 550 points that could be better spent on skimming tanks?
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Warhead
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Wed Mar 25, 2009 8:32 pm 
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In that the Swoops are hard to hit and the Exarchs are unable to be targeted over the Swoops then yes, they are an excellent screening escort.

In what way do you thing they can "sniper off" enemy HQ units?

The Exarchs are always at extreme cost but they mostly pay there way. You could probably do just as well using the points elsewhere (Revenant Titan Pack) but Exarchs can do it all and are way cool.




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Malleus
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 5:56 am 
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I got it mixed up and for some reason thought they had sniper ability =)
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zap123
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:22 am 
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Ohhhh...now that would be UGLY!!!!  :_(

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zap123
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 7:23 am 
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Quote: (Juffo-Wup @ 24 Mar. 2009, 00:11 )

Yes you have, zap.  My Wolf Lords Warlord Titan has one.  Right next to the Plasma Destructor.  I'll take a pic tonight when I find it (I packed it away recently as I cleaned up my gaming room).

Stop packing away Epic stuff!

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Malleus
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 6:53 pm 
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is it only me or are the Eldar Titan weapons just ... BOOOORING!
there is nothing realy that makes me want to take any of them...

I've thought up 3 titan loadouts, all needs warlocks powers to realy be an effective force but they are still not fun..
(well the tremor cannon could be a phantom I guess, but the 100pts for 3+ psy save and awesome powers? hell yeah!)

Destroyer:
720* Warlock Titan with 2x Tremor Cannon & 2x Winglasers

Charger:
550 Warlock Titan with Powerfist,Heat Lancex 2x Missile Wings
using Witchsight for protection it might be an ok CC beast against anything not a CC titan
or mindshout against low morale armies

Psycho!
700 Warlock Titan with 2x Psychic Lance & 2x Winglasers


SO what Phantom Titan Loadouts do everyone else use?
(and what warlock loadouts too!)
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Warhead
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Thu Mar 26, 2009 8:55 pm 
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Phantom 2x Tremor Cannon and 2x Wing Lasers (Wing Missile launchers should be -2TSM IMO as they are just lame otherwise... even Firestorm Knights get a -2TSM... whinge, grumble, complain...)

Warlock/Phantom 2x Pulsar Lasers, 2x Laser Wings... I might on occasion take a PsiCannon just to annoy any Chaos players but you can stick the power fist... it is sucky IMO. It wont make much diference to the Titans ability to contend in close combat.

Heat Lance!?. realy?.. is it much good?.. I would rather have another Pulsar.

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zap123
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 2:47 am 
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CC rusher - Phantom with Heat Lance, P-Fist and two missile wings.  450 points neat.  If you upgrade to twin Lascannon wings, it can rush in and strip a Reaver (4 shots at 3+ and 4 shots at 4+ = no shields) and then pulverise it with the Heat Lance in one turn (550 points).

Budget long range banger - Phantom, Twin Tremor Cannon, Lascannon & Flamewind wings.  Great against Gargants, and only 600 points.

Standard - Phantom, Twin Pulsars, Twin Lascannon wings.  Awesome, but is 750 points.

Warlock - Twin Psi-Cannon, one of each wing.  Scary for Chaos and infantry, 650 points.




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Malleus
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Fri Mar 27, 2009 6:58 pm 
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Is there any reason why there are different types of Scatter Lasers in the Eldar List?

25cm 3dice 5+ 0
50cm 2dice 4+ 0

its even more strange that the longer (better) version is the crew antigrav-mounted version..
the warwalker/knight version is the sucky 25cm version ...
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zap123
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:52 am 
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There is no platform version.

Back to previous topic, I took a photo of my Mr Pinchy.  Dud photo, but it shows the FCC pretty clearly:


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Malleus
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 6:20 am 
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You are right, there are stats for it, but no supportcard for it.

and I still cant make an Eldar 4000p army Im satisfied with!

------- 1000p Saim-Hann Craftworld Allies ------- (these are almost allways a given for what they bring)
150* Harlequins
650 Saim-Hann Wind Rider Host
150 Firestorm AA
50 Fireprism

I also want:
300 Nightwings
100 Vibro-Cannon Battery (maybe more then 1, pref 2) great for demolishon works!
150 Doomweaver Battery (cool but for them to be effective I'd need to buy 4 cards or something)
720* Warlock Titan with 2x Tremor Cannon & 2x Winglasers
900 Tempest Host (marginally better then 2 Falcon hosts against most targets, but they look good!)

I just cant make it up into a viable balanced army that I want to paint up however much I try, damn frustrating...
Still more frustrating is the fact that Saim-Hann cards are so much better then the other craftworlds
like:
Ulthiwe: more guardian stands.. with no falcons? come on... who want that?
Ulthiwe (wasnt ulthiwe supposed to have more warlocks or something? perhaps a company Seer Counciel card with 1 Farseer and 2 Warlocks leading 1 Detachment of guardians and 2 Detachment of Storm guardians?)

Biel-Tan: slightly better, but by adding the another stand to an aspect that means you cant buy waveserpents for 1 detachment, let the Phoenix lords lead by example as an own detachment atleast

Iyanden: 1 more Wraithguard detachment isnt that hot, but its workable

Alaitoc: Gets a good unit, I'd just like em to get some kind of Company card as well, or perhaps with their (fluff) good relationship with the harlequins they might get something form the harlequin list OR that harlequins are support cards too perhaps?

despite all that I love my eldars =(
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scream
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 8:44 am 
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Taking a Saim-Hann ally just to get a bigger Wind host rider and not suffering army composition penaltys... :shutup:  :shutup:  :disagree:

I think Warhead now understand why we try to put limitations on army lists...

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Warhead
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 9:59 am 
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Zap, Mr Pinchy is delighted.  :))  Very cool model BTW. I've still to make any Chaos Titans yet. I seem to have one of these towers and maybe two of the flat ones too...

I think Warhead now understand why we try to put limitations on army lists...


:))  Um... Nope, sorry Scream... I still don't think it needed fixed. Squat Bike Guild vs. Eldar Windrider host..?

I know it has been said before that it is a bad idea to measure other races units to the one being discussed but to me that just seems like we are throwing away another measuring stick that we can judge the problem by. I don't accept the sense in that, other than it helps those who wish to defend the changes.  :tongue:

I've got to admit that even with the large and inexpensive Windrider Hosts, I have played plenty of games where I have been soundly beaten. The last game I played in the Glasgow Games Workshop store is a point in fact. My opponent had no bikes or such but my Windriders were broken without any gain in return... ok, my own bad leadership had a major part to play but...

Now I don't want to put words in Malleus mouth or speak for him but I did notice words like...  
...and I still cant make an Eldar 4000p army I'm satisfied with!  
and...
...damn frustrating...

I think I can sympathise with this. I too have been trying to make satisfactory armies using the v5 lists and every time I end up frustrated... odd that this was not the case before. There is something wrong here.

I see no reason why the Windriders can't be available to all Eldar Factions (bring back the Wild Riders!) and keep them "Unique" (one Host per 3000 points). Over pricing units because you want to set limitations is a bit unimaginative and frankly it doesn't work, players always want the most for their points... and make the choices they think are best. Trying to make them make the choices you think are best might be why we get annoyed.

Malleus... some nice ideas. Has anyone ever thought of Warlocks leading Guardian Hosts for Ulthwie?.. kinda' like the Spirit Host. A Storm Guardian Host might be an idea too.

Biel-Tan: slightly better, but by adding the another stand to an aspect that means you cant buy waveserpents for 1 detachment, let the Phoenix lords lead by example as an own detachment at least
The Phoenix Lord Host sounds like a cool idea, but I have yet to try it. Malleus, not sure I understand about the wave serpents... I won't use them for troops as they have to stay in formation and ties them down too much.

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Malleus
 Post subject: Returning Epic player needs some Army advice
PostPosted: Sat Mar 28, 2009 12:04 pm 
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Quote: (Warhead @ 28 Mar. 2009, 08:59 )

Biel-Tan: slightly better, but by adding the another stand to an aspect that means you cant buy waveserpents for 1 detachment, let the Phoenix lords lead by example as an own detachment at least

The Phoenix Lord Host sounds like a cool idea, but I have yet to try it. Malleus, not sure I understand about the wave serpents... I won't use them for troops as they have to stay in formation and ties them down too much.

well also sound like a stupid thing with the eldar list, the wave serpents are TROOP transport.. that you dont want to take to troops because they are better on their own =), I dont want the Space Marines I just want the rhinos.. erm?

I know they are good, but I want to use em as the Assault APCs they are (where) supposed to be!

(either that or let me get a free waveserpent extra if I give the biel tan detachment waveserpents... *grumble!*)

I'd actually be all for killing of the Phoenix Host and instead adding an Aspect Host comprised of
1 Exarch Detachment + 3 Detachments of Aspects, starting point at 350+ with a morale of 10
that would be so much more useful..

I just want you to get some ideas flowing as the eldar list is abit boring right now =)
and howling banshees sucks!
(well they dont but damn many inf/cav/walkers have a save even if its 6+ to make em "useless" in any tournament)
I havent checked all the armies, but I wonder how many CC monster dont have saves..

*rant break*

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